I just lost a years-old eBay account...

[jeffweico]

Just venting and letting everyone know why it is best to have more than one eBay account...

I just lost a years-old stealth account with over 10,000 positive feedbacks, 99.8% positives, and just over $5,000 per month in sales.

Those of you who know me, know that I always go above and beyond the stealth techniques in the guide to keep my accounts safe and that I rarely lose them.

This account was not selling anything branded or copyrighted, so no issues there. I just received the "Indefinite Selling Restriction" email stating they were not comfortable with my business practices, etc. etc.

I have two observations from my experience that may help others:

1) It is VERY IMPORTANT that you have more than one account. Even though this DOES represent a loss to me, it is only about 7% of my total profits. Had this been my ONLY account, I would be totally screwed right now.

2) I really believe that ALL stealth accounts should stay under the $5,000 per month in sales mark. I believe that is where I went wrong. I broke my own rule and am now paying the price. $5,000 seems to be the magic number where they start doing underwriting and risk assessment, which would make sense as it is the same as PayPal and most merchant account providers.

I'm just putting this out there, as I had to write SOMETHING to vent and I thought this may be helpful to others.

[jeffweico]

Oh, I forgot to mention... This was my FIRST stealth account... I did try one before it, but I never thought of it as stealth since no rules were followed, I just opened it not having the first clue as to what I was doing.

I feel like I should be making a funeral here...

Sorry to hear it Jeff.

Atleast you have back ups in place.

Was it out of the blue?

[BigCJ]

Ebay seems to be losing its mind.

TONS of accounts going down for no rhyme or reason.

So sorry for your loss.

[ilcarletto]

Sorry jeffweico... I do understand how you feel.

I have 3 main accounts and are my first stealth accounts. I care them very much... sound silly but it is true. I would be sad if I lose one of them.
They are precious to me.

Sorry for your loss.

[ovidiu]

As a person who takes this sort of thing VERY personally, I know how you feel Jeff, and I sympathize. I am the kind of person who would be down for WEEKS over this sort of thing.

And yes, you are absolutely correct. It just underwrites the need to have DOZENS, if possible, of accounts going!

[jeffweico]

Originally Posted by just_smile

Sorry to hear it Jeff.

Atleast you have back ups in place.

Was it out of the blue?

It was the strangest thing... Back in the day when I sold branded stuff, I would get these all the time. I always tried to send receipts, sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't work.

But this account was not selling anything branded, copyrighted or high-risk. I got an MC011 notice asking for receipts for 2 items. My account was not shut down, but the 2 items were removed. When I looked at them, they looked like I ended them early.

I wasn't too worried, I thought eBay was just trying to make sure I had the items in stock and was not drop-shipping or anything. I thought for sure the account would be just fine.

Then, about 3 hours later, before I could even send the invoices, I get the "Indefinite Restriction" email. The account is open and I can still buy, but I cannot list any items and they removed the items I had listed on that account. There were 5,400 of them. I had an anchor store and everything. I was really trying to build that account as I have had it for years with no problems, except for the occasional kooky buyer. My refund rate was less than 1/2 of 1%. You would have to scroll down several pages to find a negative feedback (99.8% positive).

For months, I have kept telling myself that I needed to get rid of the listings that were not selling. Some have been up for 2 years without a single sale. But I got busy and that is not exactly a chore I like doing anyway, so it was low on my priority list.

The things that upset me about it was that it is my oldest stealth account, I put a lot of time and work into making all of those listings (these were not books or media items, so it was not like I just uploaded a spreadsheet of UPC codes or ISBN numbers), it was doing well gross-sales wise (I was improving the net), and I thought that since it had survived for so long, I could push it past the $5k per month mark.

I think that is where I made my mistake. At $5k, it probably went into risk management/underwriting and someone at eBay didn't like something they saw. I have no idea what that would be, but I'm sure it was SOMETHING. There is no way I am going through all of the listings to try to pinpoint what it was. Besides, it could be something other than the listings they didn't like. Maybe they tried to run a credit check on my stealth user. Maybe they just didn't like my stealth name. Who knows?

I shared to vent, but also to let people know how important it is to have more than one account. And also to put it out there that you may want to think twice before allowing a stealth account to go over $5,000 in monthly sales.

The attached PayPal account is fine and I don't think it will die. So, I could always use it for something else.

I'm taking a hit, but at least it is not a HUGE hit. It could have been a lot worse.

[wtfebay]

Ahh yes, getting the ban hammer for no reason. Happens all the time. I have tried all kinds of techniques, including selling as much as possible in the shortest amount of time possible. Sometimes you just get a feeling that the ban is coming.

It must be related to the 2 items they took down. I dont believe in coincidences when ebay is involved.

What a horrible situation.

Are you going to appeal? It's worth a shot once you're over the initial shock.

[jeffweico]

Originally Posted by just_smile

It must be related to the 2 items they took down. I dont believe in coincidences when ebay is involved.

What a horrible situation.

Are you going to appeal? It's worth a shot once you're over the initial shock.

I'm going to call them on Monday. The MC011 said that uploading the receipts would start the appeal process. But I never uploaded them, because before I could do so, I got the indefinite restriction email. This seems totally unreasonable to me, but eBay is famous for that.

The MC011 didn't ask for any ID docs, but if that is what it comes down to, I'll just let it go. I'm not going to ⊗⊗⊗⊗ anything.

Maybe I should have turned this account into a business account. Most of mine already ARE, but this one was doing so well, I always figured, why rock the boat?

Profit wise, it is just 7% of my business, so I'm all right. I wanted to revamp the listings on that account anyways, so I will just take the stuff I want to re-list and do it across 3 or maybe 4 stealths.

This may turn out to be a blessing in disguise. I was getting a little bit lazy over the past month or so, and this gave me the kick in the butt I needed to get motivated again.

[GhostOfAmazon]

Jesus......

Jeff, I know we haven't exchanged words personally yet, but since this is the first time....

I've read MANY of your posts.....dozens, if not hundreds. Your advice is sage-like....I feel like I'm hearing the words of the Pope of eBay and Amazon when you write. Hearing that you lost an account is very humbling......I'm sorry for your loss.

Thanks for sharing with us, and thank you for the humbling reminder. No matter what---all of our days are numbered. Hell, even the "legitimate" eBay users (many of whom were suspended and ended up here) will eventually receive the banhammer from eBay. It's just the way they seem to do business.

Either way....please keep us updated. I hope that you get your account back. You're one of the pros here, and if anyone can do it, you can.

[muzzie]

Having at least 3 accounts at a time is a must, as even totally legit accounts go down sometimes. My main rule of EB is, "if I can't change it, I should do whatever required to adapt to it".

[jeffweico]

Originally Posted by GhostOfAmazon

Jesus......

Jeff, I know we haven't exchanged words personally yet, but since this is the first time....

I've read MANY of your posts.....dozens, if not hundreds. Your advice is sage-like....I feel like I'm hearing the words of the Pope of eBay and Amazon when you write. Hearing that you lost an account is very humbling......I'm sorry for your loss.

Thanks for sharing with us, and thank you for the humbling reminder. No matter what---all of our days are numbered. Hell, even the "legitimate" eBay users (many of whom were suspended and ended up here) will eventually receive the banhammer from eBay. It's just the way they seem to do business.

Either way....please keep us updated. I hope that you get your account back. You're one of the pros here, and if anyone can do it, you can.

Thanks for the compliment. But I can assure you, I am just like everyone else here - trying to make a living without being shut down by eBay and Amazon.

The reason I don't lose too many accounts is, I don't sell shoddy products or counterfeits, I try to treat my customers fairly, I ALWAYS answer everybody - even the morons - and I don't mind spending a few bucks a month on each account.

I think the two biggest mistakes people make is they want to sell counterfeits because of the profit margins, resulting in a lot of lost accounts and they don't want to spend any money in the process of making money.

For example, it costs me $7 per month for each phone number I maintain on an account. It works out to $3.50 per month per active account - one eBay and one Amazon. A lot of people want to avoid paying that, so they use Google voice. And that works SOMETIMES. I would rather spend the money than have a problem down the road.

I use a new PC (a used "new" PC) for each pair of stealth accounts. I LOVE LAPTOPS! A used one costs maybe $100 (sometimes I can get them for even less) and eliminates the possibility of anything going wrong when logging in. I make a wallpaper screen for each one with the stealth name.

I pay for a separate internet stick for each laptop, anywhere between $25 and $40 per month. I use all different providers - FreedomPop, Cricket, T-Mobile, AT&T, Virgin and Verizon. I really like Virgin - most people don't because of the Static IP addresses, but I consider them a HUGE PLUS since nobody else will be on my IP! With my method, I don't have to keep track of IP addresses and maintain spreadsheets tracking them.

I try to mix it up with different operating systems - Windows 8, 7, Vista, XP and some Linux. I use different browsers and install different plugins.

I also use a couple of VPS's, but I pay maybe $20 per month for a Linux box. I know that there are a bunch of $5 providers out there, but they go down frequently, with NO WARNING and then you have to scramble to find another provider in the same area and the IP changes, putting your accounts at risk. And the $5 ones are also overused.

I DO have one PC that still runs 3 accounts. It was originally 5, but two of them went down. I spoof the MAC addresses on those accounts even though some forum members argue adamantly that it is not necessary. They may be right, but it only took 5 minutes to install the program, so what is the harm?

I always do stuff like that, I'm always looking to avoid ANY possibility of being linked. I use different gift cards and VCC's. Different banks. ANYTHING to make them as different as possible.

My methods are more expensive, but I don't lose too many accounts.

The other thing is, when dealing with people on eBay and Amazon, you have to be as professional as possible - even if the buyer is a scam artist or an idiot. Even if you want to reach through the screen and punch them. Losing your cool can EASILY lose you an account. Try starting your response to an inquiry on Amazon with "Dear MotherF*****r" and see how fast the account is toast!

Those are my non-secret secrets. They are not very technical in nature (I am more of a businessperson than a technical person) and are not difficult to do.

It works for me...

[nodeal]

RIP fallen soldier.

Let us know what ebay says when you call in.

I am completely desensitized to losing accounts at this point. I used to mourn, now I create 2 for every 1 I lose.

[shani1212]

Sorry to hear about your account Jeff. But as you mentioned have back up a/c. this is the only way to go with Ebay these days...I have one account 3 yr. old recently got trademark violation. Email from Ebay stated that "YOUR LISTINGS HAVE BEEN REMOVED. DO NOT RELIST THIS ITEM AGAIN OR ELSE YOU MAY LOOSE YOUR ACCOUNT OR IT MAY BE SUSPENDED. GUESS WHAT GUYS?
item was not removed from ebay end. Second month relisted the same item and still selling. So I must say Ebay has gone crazy nowadays and anything is possible;therefore, have back up accounts as many as possible...

[rsot]

I feel gutted by your loss jeffweico - interesting suggestion about the <5k tip...decent observation coupled with spreading sales over various accounts

[jeffweico]

Originally Posted by rsot

I feel gutted by your loss jeffweico - interesting suggestion about the <5k tip...decent observation coupled with spreading sales over various accounts

Actually, that came from a conversation I had with someone at First Data Corp. I forgot how it came up, but he told me that almost anybody could get approved to accept credit cards, but that at $5,000 or more per month in sales was where their standards became more stringent. That is when they want to see good credit, money in the bank, all of your I's dotted and T's crossed, so to speak.

I had thought given the age of the account and since there were no issues it would be OK. But now I know better. It was probably a lesson worth learning. I didn't really lose any money and I will replace it with a few stealths and be back to normal in a couple of months. So, all in all it is no big deal, but I DID hate losing all that great feedback!

And the fact is, I don't REALLY know why it went down. It could have been something I did, or it could have been that the rep reviewing the account had a buddy selling the same things and decided I had to go. But I am pretty confident that the sales going over $5,000 is what lead to the review.

[GhostOfAmazon]

Originally Posted by jeffweico

Actually, that came from a conversation I had with someone at First Data Corp. I forgot how it came up, but he told me that almost anybody could get approved to accept credit cards, but that at $5,000 or more per month in sales was where their standards became more stringent. That is when they want to see good credit, money in the bank, all of your I's dotted and T's crossed, so to speak.

I had thought given the age of the account and since there were no issues it would be OK. But now I know better. It was probably a lesson worth learning. I didn't really lose any money and I will replace it with a few stealths and be back to normal in a couple of months. So, all in all it is no big deal, but I DID hate losing all that great feedback!

And the fact is, I don't REALLY know why it went down. It could have been something I did, or it could have been that the rep reviewing the account had a buddy selling the same things and decided I had to go. But I am pretty confident that the sales going over $5,000 is what lead to the review.

Thanks for the detailed reply. Please let us all know what happens with the phone call tomorrow. I'm certain no matter what, the call will be enlightening. Hopefully, you'll get the account back, but, barring that, the representative will give you an idea as to why your account was shut down.

[rsot]

@jeffweico - my own sidenote experience - I have found First Data Corp. to be a horrible card processor for my clinic consultations. Poor customer service and asking about personal info about my health clients...anyhow.

[GreenBean]

Originally Posted by jeffweico

Actually, that came from a conversation I had with someone at First Data Corp. I forgot how it came up, but he told me that almost anybody could get approved to accept credit cards, but that at $5,000 or more per month in sales was where their standards became more stringent. That is when they want to see good credit, money in the bank, all of your I's dotted and T's crossed, so to speak.

Not a pleasant shock, jeff'. Nothing is sacred with ebay.


Interesting concept with the amount. The banks monitor amounts of $5000. Would seem ebay ( & by default paypal) flags accounts.

[muzzie]

Well, even the highly experienced veterans of stealth get kicked sometimes. It just proves my theory, that getting kicked from EB is just a matter of time, if you sell a lot, and it just does not matter, what you sell. Nice tactics prolongs stealth to several years, but still, they can find something they don't like and kick you out for no reason. I guess, that they know, that they are the most democratic and the biggest platform on the Net, so they can afford kicking anyone for any reason, and feel fine about it. So... if they kick even these guys, who perfectly do stealth, everyone now just clearly understand, that having several accounts is a must, just because suspension is inevitable if selling a lot, only the doomsday date moves back and forth because of the stealth methods used.

[jeffweico]

Originally Posted by muzzie

Well, even the highly experienced veterans of stealth get kicked sometimes. It just proves my theory, that getting kicked from EB is just a matter of time, if you sell a lot, and it just does not matter, what you sell.

Well, just because you don't sell something that violates eBay policy does not mean that you won't eventually get shut down for other reasons. That much is true.

BUT - if you are selling things you shouldn't be selling, your accounts WILL go down a lot faster. So, in a way, it DOES matter what you sell.

For example, let's say you started a stealth account today. For the next 90 days, you nurture the account and sell only low-risk, non-branded items. Then, you start selling Disney DVD's - the classics, like Snow White and Cinderella that are heavily counterfeited. At that point, your account stands a MUCH HIGHER chance of going down than if you sold bird cages.

So, it DOES matter what you sell as far as account longevity is concerned. Of course, it is also true that the account selling bird cages could go down as well. With eBay there are no guarantees. That is why we advise that people should have multiple accounts - so that if you lose one, you are not automatically put out of business.