PayPal's damages caused by Acceptable Use Policy violation

[mine]

Gaining money through deception is indeed illegal.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

If you can't see it then clearly you're never going to accept why most of those moaning here will never see their funds, and rightly so. You're the one championing their cause yet you can't even spot those who are clearly and deliberately breaking paypals AUP.

It is so obvious that it beggars belief that you can't find it for yourself.

Obviously I cannot find it because you opted to use the word "illegal" which by definition means: "contrary to or forbidden by law, especially criminal law.

There is a big difference between criminal related matters and what messy did. PayPal believed that Messy violated their Acceptable Use Policy selling services that PayPal doesn't support. PayPal believes then by right they have the right to fine any account $2,500 per transaction which is a civil dispute. Now people on here who created stealth paypal accounts that maybe considered criminal as you used bogus information to setup a PayPal Account to mislead your buyers/sellers.

[rsot]

Originally Posted by Messy52312

I have retained a Candida lawyer. I am in the process of handing them all my paypal records so that they can write a letter to PayPal on my behalf. But yes I have officially retained a lawyer.

Best of luck Candida - interesting

[suepp]

Wesker did you setup a facebook group ? this needs a place where those who are actually interested in helping each other can get together .in the future there will be many so act now to prepare for future.it may take years .btw i have never made or used a stealth account but i know this is the place to go if you need one

[superMan111]

paypal stolen people money 2020

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[superMan111]

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https://youtu.be/FqqCWCy-jj0

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[XPinksDude826]

I already spoke to the game company and they said what I do is not illegal. Although they told me they do not like me. Also if a company or someone has a problem with products your selling through your Paypal account. You usually receive a dmca report through PayPal from the company or person who is upset. Also it doesn't really matter because clearly people here are being fined for other products like clothes or watever. This is solely Paypal doing this at their own discretion regardless for what your selling.

I have also been reading PayPals policy every night for the past week. I have found lots of new things for example:

Paypal has this hidden in the Canadian and USA Policy

For any claim (excluding claims for injunctive or other equitable relief) where the total amount of the award sought is less than $10,000 Canadian Dollars, you may elect to resolve the dispute in a cost effective manner through binding non-appearance-based arbitration. If you elect arbitration, you will initiate such arbitration through an established alternative dispute resolution (“ADR”) provider mutually agreed upon by you and us. The ADR provider and the parties must comply with the following rules: (a) the arbitration shall be conducted by telephone, online and/or be solely based on written submissions, the specific manner shall be chosen by you; (b) the arbitration shall not involve any personal appearance by the parties or witnesses unless otherwise mutually agreed by the parties; and (c) any judgment on the award rendered by the arbitrator may be entered in any court of competent jurisdiction.


However in the USA policy it says this but it doesnt say it anywhere in the Canadian Policy:

Payment of all filing, administration, and arbitrator fees will be governed by the AAA's rules, unless otherwise stated in this Agreement to Arbitrate. If the value of the relief sought is $10,000 or less, at your request, PayPal will pay all filing, administration, and arbitrator fees associated with the arbitration. Any request for payment of fees by PayPal should be submitted by mail to the AAA along with your Demand for Arbitration and PayPal will make arrangements to pay all necessary fees directly to the AAA. If the value of the relief sought is more than $10,000 and you are able to demonstrate that the costs of accessing arbitration will be prohibitive as compared to the costs of accessing a court for purposes of pursuing litigation on an individual basis, PayPal will pay as much of the filing, administration, and arbitrator fees as the arbitrator(s) deem necessary to prevent the cost of accessing the arbitration from being prohibitive. In the event the arbitrator(s) determine the claim(s) you assert in the arbitration to be frivolous, you agree to reimburse PayPal for all fees associated with the arbitration paid by PayPal on your behalf that you otherwise would be obligated to pay under the AAA's rules.

For Canada Paypal does not say anything about a resolution for Canadians to go after them for over $10,000 dollars.


PayPal Legal Office (USA WHICH WE ALL KNOW THEIR ADDRESS)
2211 North First Street
San Jose, CA
95131


PayPal Legal Office (CANADA OFFICE)

11.6. Contracting Entity. “PayPal,” “we,” or “us” in this Agreement means PayPal Canada Co., a Nova Scotia corporation, whose principal place of business MaRS Centre, West Tower, 661 University Avenue, Suite 506, Toronto, ON M5G 1M1.

11.7. Notices. Any notices required by this Agreement will be provided to you by the Platform on our behalf. You agree that electronic notices and disclosures have the same meaning and effect as if we had provided you with a paper copy. Any notices to PayPal shall be considered valid only if sent by postal mail to PayPal Canada Co.., Attn: Legal Department, MaRS Centre, West Tower, 661 University Avenue, Suite 506, Toronto, ON M5G 1M1.



For Canadians we need to go through the office above to keep it within Canada. (Hopefully this helps any other Canadians who are sending letters to the san jose office.)


Anyways I have sent my paper work to my lawyer including pictures of each fine and any information associated with my PayPal account. Me and my friend are both sharing the retainer fee and have paid it already. We are considered 1 case since we both are friends in real life and sold the exact same thing so we formed a joint case.

My lawyer thinks PayPal will settle an amount thats returned to me before we have to escalate it any further. However I told her I disagree and would think that we will move to arbitration and I either get a yes or no answer if my money should be returned or not.

PayPal is not the only company who has took peoples money and forced arbitration



A quick google search about amazon sellers being locked out of there accounts with money on them or banned from amazon with a lot of money in there accounts will show you many people who have gone through this arbitration process but with amazon. Majority of these people won or settled before the Arbitration takes place. A lot of these people were selling counterfeit goods on Amazon too.

[inp]

Originally Posted by Ashley1010

If the response from the demand letter doesn’t come with resolution I am debating going to the media to investigate this. I’ll be joining anyone who is also fighting and will check for others updates daily.

Any News Ashley ?

Three days ago my 7.8K taken away under AUP. It was a Philippine account which used to sell just electronic gadgets for a long time. I had a rolling reserve on that account and that's the reason 7.8k was there. It was perma limited and 178 days gone so far.

That account was under real person, real name, real bank, and verified about 2 years ago. Just sold normal unbranded electronic gadgets. But had high refund ratio and that was the reason to perma limit.

I got perma limitations on my EU stealth accounts but pp never taken those funds, I was able to withdraw after 180 days. Before anybody asks..... There's no way those Philippine accounts get linked to my other accounts. Because that's completely run there in the Philippine and never use to login from here.

[zhangdev]

Paypal practically never protects sellers, who pay their fees on every transaction. They only protect their interests and the buyer, the percentage of buyers who can win a dispute is always higher than the seller, they can lock any seller account for 180 days and do not want to hear explanations, now they add a new AUP that can take away all the money in the seller's account. This is too dangerous, we should look for a better new payment channel, better protect us, we are sellers but we have to pay them, even a lot. I sell products priced at only $ 1, I pay paypal $ 0.33 / per transaction, that's 33%, but whenever they like, they will lock my account. Is crazy

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by agent006140

For Christ's sake,get your own merchant account to accept credit cards,unless you must sell on venues which have MP or Paypal only!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

and what if the credit card merchant account does the same thing or goes bankrupt? You're simply derailing the thread here. Has nothing to do with the topic nor does it help in anyway solve this guys issue.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by agent006140

hard to feel sorry for someone who used Paypal to sell what you sell,yoou should consider the consquences before you start selling

What's the point of even posting this? Millions of people sell items on paypal that are against their AUP. Should they also be fined? He isn't selling anything illegal.

[XPinksDude826]

Originally Posted by agent006140

hard to feel sorry for someone who used Paypal to sell what you sell,yoou should consider the consquences before you start selling

This is probably the most stupidest post I have ever seen. I did not do anything illegal and even if anyone here did do anything illegal. Its not PayPals job to take their money. PayPal should have to sue you for the money or provide proof of damages that occurred. I never asked anyone to feel sorry for for me and based of my posts does it sound like im crying? All im doing is trying to take action against PayPal because if 1 of us succeeds then all of us can. Im sorry that Im spending thousands of dollars on a ****in retainer so people here can later read if im successful or not.

Anyways my lawyer has sent all the information over to PayPal and we are waiting for their response.

I also am posting updates of what Im doing so that people in the future can read this and hopefully it can help them. Think about the people who will be reading this 5-10 years down the line if one of us succeeds.

[PepsiCoin]

Originally Posted by Messy52312

This is probably the most stupidest post I have ever seen. I did not do anything illegal and even if anyone here did do anything illegal. Its not PayPals job to take their money. PayPal should have to sue you for the money or provide proof of damages that occurred. I never asked anyone to feel sorry for for me and based of my posts does it sound like im crying? All im doing is trying to take action against PayPal because if 1 of us succeeds then all of us can. Im sorry that Im spending thousands of dollars on a ****in retainer so people here can later read if im successful or not.

Anyways my lawyer has sent all the information over to PayPal and we are waiting for their response.

I also am posting updates of what Im doing so that people in the future can read this and hopefully it can help them. Think about the people who will be reading this 5-10 years down the line if one of us succeeds.

agent is a troll who doesn't have or operate a stealth account. please ignore the troll. agent has mental problems and makes the average ret ard seem like a genius. keep up the great work and good luck!

[raseiro]

This is my complaint to BBB, I suggest everyone try this approach, along with sending a formal letter and threatening arbitration (if you are in the US and Canada, not sure about elsewhere. Good luck everyone and keep getting the word out about these crooks.


Thank you for using the Better Business Bureau's Online Complaint System.

Your complaint has been assigned case # *****
Correspondence regarding this complaint will be emailed to : *****

Pleaseprint a copy of this for your records.

Filed on : March 5 2020

Filed by :
*****

Filed against :
PayPal, Inc.
3000 Hanover Street
Palo Alto CA 94304

Complaint Description:
Paypal illegally and arbitrarily seized my entire account balance of $2804.74 Paypal closed both my business and personal accounts for alleged violations of their rules. I followed their rules to the letter. I sold on ebay and none of the items I sold were in anyway prohibitied. Paypal never disclosed why they closed my accounts. Paypal has a monopoly on Ebay so when they closed my accounts I lost my livelihood, I was making $50,000-60,000 a year on ebay. When they froze my accounts they said funds would be held for 6 months then released. A few days before this happened my balance dissapeared, was seized for "damages". This is unfair and really is criminal, no other company does this, banks, credit card companies, only Paypal think they can get away with this; -Paypal mislead me to believe I would get my money after 180 days and then withdrawing a week before, this is deceptive practice and in Massachusetts against the law; Seized my money without any notice, with no reason given; the clause in your "Acceptable Use Policy that states you have a right to seize accounts for damages is buried in a 50,000 word document, is not outlined and therefore it is unreasonable to expect the average consumer to be made aware of this. These account seizures have recently started in late 2019 and at the time that I signed up for my account in 2008 this policy was never made clear and I never received any notice of it in subsequent years. I am not the only person this happened to, there are loads of complaints online: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/paypal...violation.html

Account ID: *****

Your Desired Resolution:
I would like paypal to refund me the $2804.74 they stole from me. I would like them to reinstate my accounts so I can sell on ebay again.

This case will be reviewed by a complaint specialist at the Better Business Bureau, and then forwarded to the business for their response. It is our policy to allow the business 30 working days to respond to your complaint. You will be notified when the business has responded.

What would you like to do next?
View the status of your complaint
Return to the BBB Homepage BBB Privacy Policy

[james_112233]

Originally Posted by raseiro

I am not the only person this happened to, there are loads of complaints online: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/paypal...violation.html

You linked to a forum that guides people on how to sign up to the platform you're complaining about using made up phantom details ?

Bad idea.

[Pathos]

I needed a roar today! that is brilliant.

[Twisty]

Originally Posted by raseiro

. I am not the only person this happened to, there are loads of complaints online: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/paypal...violation.html

Wow.

[XPinksDude826]

Hello Everyone! I thought I would post an update of whats currently happening between me and PayPal.

So basically my lawyer has sent a letter to PayPal but we have received no response from them. So 7 days ago we sent another letter though registered mail and we gave them a time period to respond. So they have to respond to this new letter 100 percent. However if they decide not to respond within the given time period then that's where i will be escalating things further.

Another extra thing here I should mention is. I still have PayPal accounts that are AUP limited but have passed 180 days and I got the email saying I can withdraw. However They are not letting me add a bank account or credit card to them to withdraw the money. When I call customer support they tell me this limitation is severe and that they have to message their back office to see If i am even allowed to have the funds. PayPal is also being really shady on the phone lines over this whole AUP thing. When you call them they will straight up tell you there is a chance you can lose your money based off the limitation you have.

I dont understand how this is legal and what the hell is going on over there at PayPal.


I will post an update If i get a reply from PayPal and if they dont reply I have no problems taking this further.

[rsot]

Best of luck Messy52312

[Vivandoencolor]

Originally Posted by Messy52312

Hello Everyone! I thought I would post an update of whats currently happening between me and PayPal.

So basically my lawyer has sent a letter to PayPal but we have received no response from them. So 7 days ago we sent another letter though registered mail and we gave them a time period to respond. So they have to respond to this new letter 100 percent. However if they decide not to respond within the given time period then that's where i will be escalating things further.

Another extra thing here I should mention is. I still have PayPal accounts that are AUP limited but have passed 180 days and I got the email saying I can withdraw. However They are not letting me add a bank account or credit card to them to withdraw the money. When I call customer support they tell me this limitation is severe and that they have to message their back office to see If i am even allowed to have the funds. PayPal is also being really shady on the phone lines over this whole AUP thing. When you call them they will straight up tell you there is a chance you can lose your money based off the limitation you have.

I dont understand how this is legal and what the hell is going on over there at PayPal.


I will post an update If i get a reply from PayPal and if they dont reply I have no problems taking this further.

what would the next step be? i dont have an attorany but i sent them a certified letter and was ingored

[yotano211]

Originally Posted by agent006140

I already spoke to the game company and they said what I do is not illegal. Although they told me they do not like me.
---------
what do they care,it is not their money,they told you they dont like you,they can say the moon is made of cheese and it is blue.just remember what I told you about that sausage making machine,

So whats your point in trying to bring everyone down. Some people are actually selling legit items.
Thankfully I pretty much got out of ebay selling and become a truck driver.

[XPinksDude826]

Originally Posted by Vivandoencolor

what would the next step be? i dont have an attorany but i sent them a certified letter and was ingored

Unfortunately I do believe this is something that would have to be pursued legally. The only reason Im doing the letter is because my lawyer is forcing me to do it because its part of the legal process before you take it further. When I met with my lawyer at her head office I was already saying this letter isn't going to work and we need to contact PayPal to form some sort of arbitration setup/meeting or sue them. However she advised me to continue with the letter and give them a response time.

Contacting customer support or contacting the better business bureau isnt going to resolve this. However I do not think anyone's money is lost its just you will have to pursue it legally. I'm willing to go full out on this because it just takes 1 of us to succeed and then they are so ****ed.

I also noticed there is people on Twitter complaining about their money being taken and there is more posts on PayPals community form and new threads being opened up about this issue on other forms.

This might be mean to say but the more people who have their money taken from them. The more of an issue this becomes which means more people talking about it and more people going after them. Im hoping also that it gets so bad to where there forms are flooded with complaints that some government agency steps in or something.

I already said this in a post above about how people have won against Amazon in arbitration. So there is hope.


New People affected I saw
https://twitter.com/sama_irshaid/sta...722490369?s=21
https://twitter.com/smokerbenito/sta...472842242?s=21
https://twitter.com/spoildior/status...014289408?s=21
https://twitter.com/realelliesilk/st...470617090?s=21

https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/ne...-risk.1194522/

https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showt...php?t=5795355&