listing on china eBay

[rsot]

Thanks for the clarification BubbleTea - my bad on the light ignorance.

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by claudio

thank's for all.
I want to ask something else, what do you think about selling exhaust for motocycles in Thailand, Vietnam or Malaysia with their eBay?? do you know if eBay has failed even in this places? if eBay has failed do you know another way to sell on-line like with TAOBAO but in Thailand,Vietnam or Malaysia?

thank's for your answers again.

Claudio

Yes, eBay has failed in these places.

For these sort of niche items in these places, it is better to look for forums as your selling platform as that is where you will find most of your buyers.

Malaysia has lots of forums for interest groups.
I believe they have a forum for bikers.
The best way would be to sell on these forums.
Look for the big and active ones; you can see this from the number of total members and members online (at their normal time).
You may have to pay a fee to advertise as a seller on some forums but it will be worth it and it is usually an annual fee of a small sum.
Definitely much lower cost than eBay.
English is widely used online in Malaysia so you would have no problem.

Thailand and Vietnam are more difficult as they do not use English.
They probably have forums for bikers as well but it would be in Thai and Vietnamese.
Also, these are poorer countries and the reason they ride motorbikes is not for hobby but because it is one of the cheapest transport to own.
The rich in these countries own cars.
So bearing in mind that the ones riding bikes are poorer people, who can get their exhaust at dirt cheap prices, as someone has mentioned, you do not have a market for high-end exhaust or anything that comes from Italy.

If you are looking to expand your market to Asia, and I'm assuming that you're selling at least mid to high end stuff (if you're selling low end stuff, forget about it totally as you cannot compete with the prices here), I'll advise that you target countries with higher purchasing power like Japan, Korea, Singapore. Malaysia is ok too because there are many motorbike hobbyists. You can sell on the Gmarket sites on Japan, Korea, Singapore and the motorbike forums. I think there are some thriving motorbike forums in Singapore. For Japan and Korea, you will need translators.

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by cortex

FIZZYFISH

Thank soooooo much for your reply

Yes Im planning a trip to Guangzhou [guangdong] and also to Shenzen(?)
I dont think im up to Container level just yet but i definitely want to be shipping some big boxes over..most probably by ChinaPost airmail and some by EMS.

The only things im not sure of are
1. Will they just let me walk into their factory and start choosing items or do i need to go through an agent? How does it work?

2. In terms of quantities...im looking to buy in the 500pcs - 1000pcs. Do you think thats a good enough size? I would like to buy many products so if i can buy in the 100pcs then that would be even better...but ive no idea how they might think if i said i want 100pcs...maybe they would think its too small?

Wow I am surprised that you are buying from "wholesalers" in UK and not direct from China.
My personal opinion for a real business is that you always have to get goods as near to the source as possible to get the lowest price.
And that you need to get the lowest price for a viable long-term business in order to be profitable and competitive.
You can do that middle man thing for starters and short term, but not for the long term.
Oh well, its good you are thinking of getting your goods direct from China now.

I have been to different parts of China two times, to get different types of goods. Where you go to will depend on what you are looking for. You first need to know this.
If you are thinking Guangzhou and Shenzhen, then I'm guessing it's most likely electronics.
Guangzhou has lots of wholesale markets besides electronics too, like clothing, shoes, toys, leather products, etc.
Shenzhen is mostly electronics and most of electronics are manufactured in or around Shenzhen (some Dongguan which is between Shenzhen and Guangzhou).

It is unlikely that you will walk into a factory to look for your goods. I have hardly heard of anyone doing this. And especially if you cannot speak Chinese, don't think about it. Factories are unlikely to entertain anyone who is not buying in the thousands. Factories focus on production, not sales and customer service. 2nd, it is hard to locate factories selling what you are looking for, unless you have the product and can see the address on the product. Alibaba is a wholesale website where you will find tons of Chinese wholesale goods, I suggest you have a look. Many of them who say that they are the factory are actually agents.

Ok, forget about factory. This is how you and most people source for their goods. In China, there are lots of wholesale centres. They are like shopping centres filled with tons of little shops except that their business is wholesale. These are mostly the agents of the factories. Some of them may be directly linked to the factory or some may be a third party agents. In any case, they sell the goods at so-called wholesale prices. You will get a slightly better rate from direct factories agents but you will not know who they are unless they tell you (sometimes they do and you can verify this if their price is lower) or you have a knowledgeable buying agent.

I advise that you should be clear on what you're looking for as the massive amount of goods with similar ones offered by many shops will surely confuse you. On top of that, the sales people are VERY GOOD SALESPEOPLE who are VERY GOOD AT CONVINCING YOU TO BUY THEIR GOODS and before you know if, you have bought your pocket empty with stuff that you're not sure will sell. Do not feel bad about walking away.

You should compare prices but get a feel for what is a good price for a good quality product and settle on a place to order. If you were to compare prices at every store, you will be there for months just to order a few items and you will be very confused and go crazy! Because there really are many stores carrying the same product.

Also, please take note that not all products that look the same are indeed the same. Different stores that carry the same product may have differences in the quality and price of the product. Sometimes there are big differences in prices and quality. This is what makes it really complicated. So you have to know what a good quality item is like. For some things like Apple accessories, some shops will tell you their products are original Apple. These will usually cost much more than the knock-offs. But then you will have to know what the originals are like to the finest detail to be able to verify. Always test all products that you are buying if its electronics. For some electronics like mobile phones, those good quality ones will come with a one year manufacturer warranty. They will paste a small gold sticker on the inside where you insert the battery for the warranty assurance. The poor quality ones have no warranty, so you can determine the quality based on this.

Most of the wholesale shops will accept your order quantity of 100-500. For electronics and accessories, they usually accept much less even. I have bought 10. But the more you buy, the lower the price goes. It also depends. Always negotiate the price. They can almost always go lower, especially if you're buying hundreds.

People who have bought goods from China all know that its a hit or miss thing. Sometimes you manage to find a good supplier. Sometimes its one that cheats you a little or has sucky goods. They will always show and display the nicest of the goods with the least physical flaws in the shop. But sometimes when you order, its a different story. Sometimes in an order, there are a number of broken ones. All these are common from purchasing from China. In China, the only certainty is uncertainty. This is 100% true when it comes to purchasing. That's why I NEVER ORDER IN BIG QUANTITIES UNLESS I HAVE HAD AT LEAST A FEW OK SHIPMENTS FROM THE SUPPLIER. You need to put them through a few test drives before you get your large shipments rolling.

I really advise against taking the plunge and ordering in the hundreds for the first time. What you should hope to achieve is to be able to find trustworthy suppliers with good quality goods at good prices. Order small quantities of goods from a few suppliers, keep the suppliers contacts, and put their goods through the test. Then you select those good ones and make a second small to medium order from them. When their goods are good again and you don't receive complaints from your customers, then you can order a medium to larger order when you're about to run out. After this third order, you are safe to make large order shipments from them. Also, another reason not to make a big order the first time is that you do not know if the goods will have customs issues for import. Then you do not know if the goods have quality issues. There is just too much uncertainty to risk a lot at one time, especially for the first time. Once you have their contacts, you do not need to go to China again to reorder. Most of them communicate well through email in English.

ALWAYS CHECK YOUR GOODS BEFORE MAKING FULL PAYMENT. They will usually ask to take a %tage of the purchase price from you when you make an order. This is normal and you should pay them (try to reduce to minimum; they are usually flexible on this). When you receive the goods, check them, then pay in full. If there are and defective goods, you can return them and deduct the expense. I have not met any seller who has tried to cheat me on order quantity (i have ordered from many sellers) but sometimes say you want 5 blue and 5 red and they may give you 3 blue and 7 red. Packing errors like this are VERY COMMON so if it is important to you, then check it.

If all these sounds overwhelming to you, there is another easier option for you. That is to use a sourcing/ buying agent. You can google for them. There are many and it is easy to find one. Most of them offer transport arrangements to bring you to the place too. They are bilingual Chinese people who can communicate well in English. You tell them what you are looking for and they bring you to the shops to see the goods. They mostly have good knowledge of where to find what and can take you directly to the shops. They act as a translator and middle-man between you and the seller. They usually also know about shipping and can advice you on that. They usually take a cut of around 10% the price of your goods. The exact rate depends on the agent.

I have never used an agent as I can speak Chinese so I can communicate smoothly with the sellers. Many of the seller at these wholesale centres can speak English. This will also depend on the type of goods you are looking for and where. In Guangzhou, I saw many sellers in the electronics wholesale centre speaking English to Arabic buyers who are there without agents. But I can see these are experienced buyers. Maybe you can try it out on your own and if you find that you need help, you can look for a buying agent. They are easy to find and just a phonecall away. lol.

For shipping, it really depends on what you are shipping, how heavy and how large. Chinapost may have limitations on the size of your boxes. You need to compare sea freight and air freight rates with ChinaPost. Depending on what you ship, A,B, or C may be the cheapest and the only way to find out is to compare. You do not have to use a whole container for freight. There is LCL, where you share a container with others. Sea freight rates are based on volume and charged per cubic metre (cbm). Air freight rates are based on weight and go by the kilo (kg). Look for a Chinese shipper from China and go for door-to-door shipping to avoid surprise charges on your side. There are usually lots of shipping companies around those wholesale centres so you can make your enquiries at the same place too.

I was in Guangzhou just a month ago for sourcing. If you can be specific about what you're looking for, I may be able to tell you where to go.

[teedon]

Originally Posted by FizzyFish

Thems folks can see your listings already though... or should be able to anyway if you state you deliver w/wide.

Good luck on selling exhausts. The last one I got for my scooter cost £6 brand new!

The markets are totally flooded in Asia with m/bike and scooter parts at prices that are unreal.

Unless you have something amazingly incredibly fantastic - like an exhaust that makes your bike fly then you may have quite a job on your hands!

If you do sell those though - please can i have one? How much to deliver to China

I also am very interested in one,if you have one.

[teedon]

Originally Posted by cortex

FIZZYFISH

Thank soooooo much for your reply

Yes Im planning a trip to Guangzhou [guangdong] and also to Shenzen(?)
I dont think im up to Container level just yet but i definitely want to be shipping some big boxes over..most probably by ChinaPost airmail and some by EMS.

The only things im not sure of are
1. Will they just let me walk into their factory and start choosing items or do i need to go through an agent? How does it work?

2. In terms of quantities...im looking to buy in the 500pcs - 1000pcs. Do you think thats a good enough size? I would like to buy many products so if i can buy in the 100pcs then that would be even better...but ive no idea how they might think if i said i want 100pcs...maybe they would think its too small?

Of course the factory will welcome you to visit them but factory is factory and they only make the money from quantity,if you go to the factory and say you will order 100 pcs,mostly they will not accept your order but if you say you will order 500 pcs -1000 pcs,they may give you a trial order but they will not too much interested.

If you need to order 100 pcs -500 pcs,you can go to the wholesale market directly,and then you can pick how many pcs you need and the wholesale price also is very low and very closed to factory price.

There are a lot of buyers working around many wholesale market everyweek and they will pick many different items with small QTY and then shipping directly from there or collect all the goods together and shipping by sea.

If you want to go to guang zhou ,now it is the good time to come,the no. 1 fair -canton fair now is open now ,so you can meet a lot of factories and supplier there.

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by teedon

If you want to go to guang zhou ,now it is the good time to come,the no. 1 fair -canton fair now is open now ,so you can meet a lot of factories and supplier there.

What is this canton fair about?
Is it at the Expo?

[cortex]

Originally Posted by teedon

If you need to order 100 pcs -500 pcs,you can go to the wholesale market directly,and then you can pick how many pcs you need and the wholesale price also is very low and very closed to factory price.

Hi FizzyFish,

Yes i have heard of the canton fair but im not sure i can fly out now. im planning trip in july/aug/september.

When you say Wholesale market....which city is this located? how can i find it?
At the moment i am buying from dhg website but i know i am paying 50-80% more than what they are paying for it...only reason i buy from them is because there is no other option to get it cheaper unless i go to china.

Also if there is some other good cities to visit then please suggest it...i read Fujian is also a good city ... and Shenzen also? about 50% of my suppliers say they are based in guangzho - If i only had to visit one city, which would you suggest?

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by cortex

Hi FizzyFish,

Yes i have heard of the canton fair but im not sure i can fly out now. im planning trip in july/aug/september.

When you say Wholesale market....which city is this located? how can i find it?
At the moment i am buying from dhg website but i know i am paying 50-80% more than what they are paying for it...only reason i buy from them is because there is no other option to get it cheaper unless i go to china.

Also if there is some other good cities to visit then please suggest it...i read Fujian is also a good city ... and Shenzen also? about 50% of my suppliers say they are based in guangzho - If i only had to visit one city, which would you suggest?

Wholesale markets are everywhere is Guangzhou!
They have different kinds of wholesale markets selling different goods.
Clothing markets are everywhere.
Electronics tend to gather in a few areas.
And a bit of other stuff around.

The largest small commodities market is in Yiwu.
I think its the largest small commodities market in the world.
When they say small commodities, its almost everything really.
Covers 5 halls and 4-5 storeys high and many sections in each hall.
There's a website for it in English.
Google Yiwu international small commodities market (or centre, not such which term).

There are many exhibitions each year for different stuff mostly in Hong Kong.
Some of these exhibitions also go to Guangzhou and Shanghai but I get the impression the HK one is largest and HK also seems to have the most product exhibitions.
I came across a website that lists the exhibitions in English.
Google Hong Kong electronics fair.

"At the moment i am buying from dhg website but i know i am paying 50-80% more than what they are paying for it...only reason i buy from them is because there is no other option to get it cheaper unless i go to china."

WoW! If you are paying that much more, then I should think its worth it for you to source yourself.
However, I doubt you are paying that much more if you account for shipping and taxes.
It's not true there is no other option but to go to China.
You can find a buying agent from China to help you source for the goods you want.
Most of them are very experienced and if you know exactly what you want, they know exactly where to get it.
They are bilingual and will be able to communicate well with you in English.
They will also help you get quotations, negotiate, buy and ship.
You typically have to pay them around 10% of the cost of goods.
Google China buying (or sourcing) agent.
You can ask them for references from people from your country and you can contact them to ask about the agents.

As I said, where you go will depend on what you are looking for.
Shenzhen is good for electronics.
Guangzhou is good for electronics, clothes, shoes, leather, bags, and a lot of stuff. Guangzhou has all kinds of wholesale markets really. I found practically everything under the sky in Guangzhou!
Guangzhou is the place where you can find a lot of electronics, a lot of clothing, and a bit of everything else.
Guangzhou and Shenzhen are very close by and you can easily visit the other city by train (1+ hr).

Chinese people from Fujian told me that Fujian is good for buying wholesale clothing.
Guangzhou also has dozens of wholesale markets for clothes.
Many of them are around the main train station.
I met a Chinese guy from another city who is a clothing seller and he was in Guangzhou to buy the wholesale clothes.

If you tell us what you're looking for, we would be able to provide better information.

By the way, for budget travellers, I recommend YHA hostels in China.
They are cheap and are generally clean and well-run.
The receptionists are usually friendly and helpful and will be able to help you if you have questions, be it tourist information or wholesale markets, etc.
Check them out on Welcome to YHA China ::???????·??????::????,????,????

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by cortex

Yes i have heard of the canton fair but im not sure i can fly out now. im planning trip in july/aug/september.

If I can sort out this stealth eBay stuff and get on track selling, I may make another buying trip around that time too.
I am thinking of Shenzhen and may go back to Guangzhou.
Maybe we can meet up there if you like.
But I can't plan anything at the moment until I sort out these troubles and clear some goods first.

[veentic]

Depends what you sell, I sold many times items to Chinese buyers, and not foreigners in China. I mean name and address in Chinese.

One of the buyers(I was impressed) had like 3000 feedback's ALL as buyer none as seller and the item he bought was $180 with shipping. I checked recent feedback's and items he bought, I calculated... DUDE he spent like $1000000 on eBay in 1 year, no joke.

But 90% of my buyers USA, Canada, UK & Australia.

My listings ONLY on English.

I would suggest to make your own web site in Chinese f*ck EBAY !!! Hire a guy from China to help with web site and make somebody ship your orders inside China, because from Europe it will take a month by regular mail or up to 45 days.

I lived in China 6 months. 99% don't speak English, and it's true as other say, there internet is different world dude. Taobao #1, QQ #2 = ))))) and that's it!!!

Only sellers know eBay, and not even all of them, only the ones from Shenzhen & HK

It's possible to sell big in China, but knowing Chinese is a must and forget eBay for that.

[veentic]

Originally Posted by veentic

Depends what you sell, I sold many times items to Chinese buyers, and not foreigners in China. I mean name and address in Chinese.

One of the buyers(I was impressed) had like 3000 feedback's ALL as buyer none as seller and the item he bought was $180 with shipping. I checked recent feedback's and items he bought, I calculated... DUDE he spent like $1000000 on eBay in 1 year, no joke.

But 90% of my buyers USA, Canada, UK & Australia.

My listings ONLY on English.

I would suggest to make your own web site in Chinese f*ck EBAY !!! Hire a guy from China to help with web site and make somebody ship your orders inside China, because from Europe it will take a month by regular mail or up to 45 days.

I lived in China 6 months. 99% don't speak English, and it's true as other say, there internet is different world dude. Taobao #1, QQ #2 = ))))) and that's it!!!

Only sellers know eBay, and not even all of them, only the ones from Shenzhen & HK

It's possible to sell big in China, but knowing Chinese is a must and forget eBay for that.

sorry, I meant 99.99% don't speak English not 99%

[yotano211]

So I guess 100% don't speak Spanish, oh man I am screwed.

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by yotano211

So I guess 100% don't speak Spanish, oh man I am screwed.

I guess its one in a million.
Buy hey, in a population of over a billion, you still have a handful! lol!

Btw, are you from Spain?
I'm trying to learn Spanish... hehe.

[FizzyFish]

Spanish!? No way. English is more common but Spansh wow that's a long shot.

This sound like a sweeping generalisation but it's true! The Chinese can't roll their r's. None of em that I have met any way... If I do it they look at you like you are crazy (they do that most the time anyway!)

Say after me ferrocarril

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by veentic

Depends what you sell, I sold many times items to Chinese buyers, and not foreigners in China. I mean name and address in Chinese.

One of the buyers(I was impressed) had like 3000 feedback's ALL as buyer none as seller and the item he bought was $180 with shipping. I checked recent feedback's and items he bought, I calculated... DUDE he spent like $1000000 on eBay in 1 year, no joke.

But 90% of my buyers USA, Canada, UK & Australia.

My listings ONLY on English.

I would suggest to make your own web site in Chinese f*ck EBAY !!! Hire a guy from China to help with web site and make somebody ship your orders inside China, because from Europe it will take a month by regular mail or up to 45 days.

I lived in China 6 months. 99% don't speak English, and it's true as other say, there internet is different world dude. Taobao #1, QQ #2 = ))))) and that's it!!!

Only sellers know eBay, and not even all of them, only the ones from Shenzhen & HK

It's possible to sell big in China, but knowing Chinese is a must and forget eBay for that.

Lol... you are mostly right... but I think its #1: QQ, #2: Taobao.

Of course you can have some buyers from China even on US eBay, especially if your shipping price is very reasonable.

What I think these Chinese buyers are looking for on US eBay, are authentic branded goods - usually things like clothing, bags, electronics, etc, but anything with a famous brand name really. These authentic branded things are the only things that they can get cheaper from US/EU eBay, compared to Taobao (if its even available) and Chinese B&M shops.
Usually the country of origin of the brand sells it the cheapest in the world. Cheapest LV in France/ EU, cheapest Abercrombie in USA, etc... and most of the famous brand names are either from US or EU, some AU.

Another thing is, even if they could get the goods at the same price or even slightly more expensive in China, it is hard to ascertain that the goods are authentic.
A Chinese person is more likely to trust an American than a Chinese who claims the goods to be authentic.
So this is why, you see that rich buyer spending thousands of dollars on US eBay.
Also do not forget that China has one of the worlds highest number of millionaires and billionaires.
Maybe that buyer just got hooked on eBay. We all know buying on eBay can be addictive too.

I'm not sure if making a online shop website in Chinese would work well, since most of them shop on Taobao. I've not yet heard of anyone who bought something from a Chinese website yet.

And I'm even more not sure if sending your goods to China to get shipped to China is a good idea. You have missed the point that the Chinese people want to buy your goods because it is in USA/EU and not from China. If you are shipping from China, they cannot be sure that your goods are indeed from USA/EU and are indeed authentic branded goods. Your goods have no differentiation from the truckloads of other stuff in China or the same brand, many being ⊗⊗⊗⊗. By doing this, you are competing with the hundreds of thousands (in a population of over a billion) of Chinese sellers as you are no different from them.

Even if you are not selling branded goods, but are selling something that may be unusual or not available in China, your overseas location is your selling point to the Chinese buyers.
Your goods being in the USA/EU is exactly the product differentiation that gives the Chinese buyers the increased perceived product value that makes them buy from you. You have to understand that it is rather strong in the mentality of Chinese people that "the grass is greener on the other side." Also, buying from overseas is sometimes (not always) regarded as a status symbol and gives the Chinese pride (and pride is very very very important to Chinese people). Wealth is a status symbol and overseas goods are almost always more expensive than in China, so it is some indication of a person's wealth to buy from overseas. Branded goods especially provide high bragging rights. A vain girl can boast to her friends that "I bought this LV bag from France", and her friends will never doubt that it is authentic, although France of course also sells ⊗⊗⊗⊗ LV bags. Even better bragging if its her boyfriend who bought it for her (while boyfriend moans to friends lol). While it is not worth a mention if you bought an LV from Taobao. In fact, better not tell anyone that its from Taobao.

I will estimate that 95% of total population in China can speak English at least on a basic level. This means being able to construct simple short sentences.
However, if we categorise by age group, I would estimate that 40% of the total population of generation Y can speak English at least on a basic level.
Generation Y refers to youths born after 1980 - this is the group that grew up with the internet and the internet forms a significant part of their lives if they live in urban areas.

If we further narrow it, I will estimate that 90% of generation Y who went to schools in urban cities can speak English.
At least 80% of generation Y who live in urban cities should be able to speak English.
This is the group that does online shopping and is the only group we are concerned with as online sellers... so it isn't so bad.
But reading is at a higher level than speaking, so maybe half of them can read English... which isn't that bad too.
At least 90% of those who went to school at a higher level have advanced command of English - this is because they learn English at higher levels as their school level increases, and of course length of learning time too.
Nevertheless, English is still their second language and it takes more mental energy for them to read English, so Chinese is definitely preferred.

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by FizzyFish

Spanish!? No way. English is more common but Spansh wow that's a long shot.

This sound like a sweeping generalisation but it's true! The Chinese can't roll their r's. None of em that I have met any way... If I do it they look at you like you are crazy (they do that most the time anyway!)

Say after me ferrocarril

Hehe... lots of us in Singapore here can roll rr's.
But we are overseas Chinese so it's likely we have evolved even biologically.
But I think you are right about them... next time I go to China I will challenge them, then roll my tongue in front of them just for fun... haha!

Perro
Burro
Burrito
... erm... ok, can't think of more for now.

[rsot]

Pretty interesting thread going.

[FizzyFish]

I will estimate that 95% of total population in China can speak English at least on a basic level

Wow which part of China have you been to?! Obviously not the same places as me!

I am in the capital and there is no way 95% of people speak English! Crikey even some of them don't speak Putonghua!! 4是4 10是10 14是14 say what!?

I think you got your numbers mixed - 5% tops can string a sentence together and that include the laowais haha

[WasTopRatedThenBanned]

Aspkin Forum Field Trip To China

Lets make it happen!

[BubbleTea]

Originally Posted by FizzyFish

Wow which part of China have you been to?! Obviously not the same places as me!

I am in the capital and there is no way 95% of people speak English! Crikey even some of them don't speak Putonghua!! 4是4 10是10 14是14 say what!?

I think you got your numbers mixed - 5% tops can string a sentence together and that include the laowais haha

Oops!
That was a typing mistake... I meant to say 95% CANNOT speak English, not can.
So yes, 5% of the total population can speak basic English.

How come I cannot edit my post now?

[FizzyFish]

Originally Posted by WasTopRatedThenBanned

Aspkin Forum Field Trip To China

Lets make it happen!

Deposits for the field-trip and a signed letter from your mum must be handed in by the end of the week.

Please make cheques out to FizzyFish, all major credit cards accepted, thankyou!

[rsot]

State Farm Insurance for the travel /mandatory!