Help - I'm getting ripped off fr £3,300

[Vonfluff]

Hi All, I hope you can help.

I joined today because I am close to tears with frustration.

Before christmas I sold a whole load ($3000) of 'delta dollars' (Flight vouchers) on ebay - we had got these after our flight was overbooked last year.

In the advert, we stated the value and that these had to be booked by 31st Dec 2009. We also stated that we would email the codes out to the successful buyer (in order to transfer these, you just give the other person the codes and names on the vouchers)

Anyway, some guy won and we waited until the funds cleared then sent the codes - along with a message saying that we were going away on the 18th of December, so if he needed anything else - he needed to contact us. He confirmed receipt in his email and said that he would contact us if he needed extra info.

All was well and we left positive feedback.

On the 12th of January, I got an email from ebay telling me that a case had been opened against me.

here is teh contents of that

Details the buyer provided:
Problem: The buyer has not received the item
The buyer has tried contacting you
The buyer paid on 02 Dec, 2009
The buyer contacted you through personal email
You have not responded to the buyer
You aren't working with the buyer to solve the problem

So, I went bonkers and went back to ebay and escalated this with the fact that we had recieved no contact from the buyer since his last email on the 4th of Dec. We offered Ebay the emails we had exchanged as evidence.

I got an email from ebay yesterday which simply said

eBay Customer Support has made a final decision and the case is closed. You can view the details of this case in the Resolution Center.
Decision:
This case has been decided in the buyer's favor.

Comments:
"Case closed."

when I went to the resolution centre it also said that "eBay Customer Support has refunded the buyer and the case is closed."

I contacted ebay via the live chat and they told me that I would have to refund the buyer. I'm really upset about this.

The vouchers were as described and the buyer did recieve them, they even emailed us to say so. We have not had any contact from them until the case arrived.

So now I'm stuck. I have to refund £1500 and the vouchers are useless as they have expired - so effectively I will have lost £1800 in vouchers and £1500 in cash - despite the fact that I did everything right.

I have appealed this and it's pending - but I would appreciate any help, assistance/thoughts here.

It just feels so unfair! The buyer had the codes and the opportunity to use them - now they have expired - can he really expect a refund? How is this fair or legal?

If you have any insight or experience in this - let me know. I'm not bothered if ebay suspend me ...I'm just damned if I'm giving the lying buyer any money. Can ebay legally take the money from me?

Hope you can help,

J

[oompaloompa]

If buyer used vouchers then of course it is unfair and illegal.

This is a common story, and as you can see now, the potential for a scammer is enormous, especially for these goods.

Firstly did you use tracking, if you didnt, rule number one, high value goods need tracking..
rule 2, scammers are attracted to high value goods, do not sell these online via paypal, harsh but its a lesson that eventually gets learnt.

there isnt anything you can do if you dont have tracking, paypal will not listen. You are in UK and therefore police normally dont get involved in these matters, but all I can suggest is to go via the company these vouchers are for and tell them situation , due to data protection I doubt you will get any info on user but you may be told at most IF vouchers have been spent (if you keep any code numbers etc on them) If you feel you have enough circumstantial evidence you could go to small claims court.

The thing is now the case is closed and Ive never heard of them reopening it, your one piece of evidence is the email saying he received it. I think it was a timing issue, they may have looked at that within the time frame. I really cant think of any other solution, this is paypals regular procedure.

update us, and re paypal, the only thing you have is that email, so hopefully they will look at it. The fact that you informed buyer youd be going away , I dont think will have a bearing on it, in your favour. Good luck

[Vonfluff]

Hi there - we never said that we would physically mail the vouchers out - we simply said that we would email the codes to the buyer.

[oompaloompa]

ok, missed that bit....so just codes...its still a time frame thing as far as paypal cases go. They are quite strict. The fact that they are expired and not testable is an obstacle, although you could get it in writing from company that those codes were valid at the time...

Another thing, although it may not be relevant, you are not allowed to send codes under ebay digital delivery rules. Items must be posted.

saying that, the fact that you sent emails, with the dates and that they said it was received is enough evidence, its whether they will reopen case that is problem.

other thing is that the buyer can say, tried those codes, and didnt work, although that would be a SND dispute

I cannot think of anything innovative to tell you, you have forwarded all info you have to paypal, from what I can see but hang in there on this thread, someone may come up with a novel idea...

[Vonfluff]

Update : just called the airline. Apparently the voucher codes were activated on dec 8th. Does this now change things?

[oompaloompa]

its really useful info, submit it to paypal and take it as high as you can.

this would be very useful info for small claims court too,

thing is you will probably never get code user info out of airline without court order....another issue is, did buyer actually sell the codes on, if so, that could be tricky..

[dburnside]

i am assuming you havent got a tracking number?

you say ebay opened the case but it will be paypal who refunds the money, has the paypal been opened as not recieved or not a described case? also paypal gives you a certain amount of time to submit your case

[oompaloompa]

its a not received case and no tracking, emailed codes over to buyer, who confirmed they received via email, thing is case is closed with paypal now.....its borderline over which way it will go with either paypal or small claims but I think seller should pursue it to the end....