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Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Hardly ever. (if done right)


That's EXACTLY how! lol

Depends on the loan size, of course. What's worse, a negative net worth, while building a business/future/life/retirement? Or just doing the best you can, with what you have, and never going in debt? The answer appears to be pretty clear.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Negative net worth is an extreme example. Taking on a loan doesn't automatically put you in the negative. lol

If you have the expendable cash, that's one thing. But for a person that is wanting to grow their business, that money can ALMOST ALWAYS be put to better use. If you are content with your current setting, then so be it. A lot of people are!

The negative net worth doesn't stay negative forever. If it's even negative to begin with.

And the fact remains, it's ALWAYS cheaper to use someone else's money. (You seem to be stuck in the mindset of loans for personal items... I'm mainly discussing business options)

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Fair enough. I concede your point, especially in a business context. It's not a business move I would prefer to make, since whatever business item you finance could potentially fall flat and not make you any money. BUT I understand what you're saying. There are certain business ventures I could see myself getting a loan for.

https://i.postimg.cc/BbPzSqBw/pdp-sq.png

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

This is something I keep trying to get people to understand, but it never seems to work. Especially with people that don't have a business. And using loans for personal items can be fine as well, because that still frees up more money for business.

Someone elses money is always cheap. Especially a mortgage. Like the previous commenter being worried about spending twice as much on your house, after 30 years.... If you can't double your investment in 30 years, then yeah, maybe it's not a good idea to take out a loan. A mortgage or home equity line of credit is insanely cheap money. You'd have to be making peanuts in your business, to not feel that to be the case.


The problem comes down to, too many people taking out too much debt for things they don't need, at very high rates. So now everyone has a negative view of it. And for them, they are right.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Right. Rentals properties are the perfect example.

Do you take $100,000 of your own cash and buy ONE property? Or do you pay 20% down on FIVE 100,000 dollar properties?

The rough comparison(no taxes, insurance, upkeep) is...

Scenario 1: Rent @ 800/month nets you 9600/year, or 9.6% ROI

Scenario 2: Rent @ 800/month nets you 9600/year each, time 5 properties = 48,000. Minus the 400/month payment on 5 $80,000 loans = $2000/month = 24,000/year in loan payments. 48,000 in rent minus 24,000 in payments = 24,000 in income. 24% ROI!

Same monetary investment, with nearly 3x the return.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Exactly. One of my main gripes with the school systems, and the lack of financial education as part of the current curriculum.

But the powers that be are getting rich from those type loans, and the general low Financial IQ citizens. So nothing will ever be done to change it. :(

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I wish i was glad but not at this present money as i am at the early stages of getting back on eBay with stealth so i am making no money right now..

Hopefully i have a successful business like most of you guys soon

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

yeah, but I know that the mitochondria is the power house of the cell.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Looks pretty on paper, but does it work as such in real life?
I mean, will lenders allow you the same conditions for properties 3, 4 & 5 as they did with 1 & 2?

Maybe it's different for you yanks, but here in the UK, it'd be challenging to accomplish. Also, 100k property here would not fetch you 800PCM, but again, you must have a different system over there.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

This........

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I was looking for you to confirm that properties 3, 4 & 5 can be gotten on the same terms as properties 1 & 2.

By the time you apply for your 5th property, you'd already be in debt of 320k.
Can you confirm that:

1. A person with 500k and excellent credit can obtain five property loans back to back in one or two years?

2. If yes, would it be for the same APR as properties 1, 2, 3, etc?

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

This thread has gone in a completely different direction lol.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Derailing threads is what we are here for. It's probably the best course of action for a thread anyway. Helps to get real discussions going.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Sooooo many variables, really. It depends on the state, the location, the bank, the person, the credit, the collateral, the net worth, the BANKER. All sorts of things.

When I was growing up, we (my parents) acquired right at 30 properties in 4-5 years. Multiple properties were with ZERO money down.

It got to the point where the banker just said "we've put x amount in this account for you, just draw out whatever you need to purchase your properties with".

Things could surely be different today, but if you make your banks money, and pay your bills on time, they will break their back to work with you.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

There’s a famous speech from Jim Rohn about being a lender vs spender. Should google it... I’m sure some of you would appreciate it.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I think I found the speech. It's been scrubbed from YT for whatever reason. :noidea:

Kinda sux because I would have much rather listened to it.

https://www.vexplode.com/en/motivati...ost-inspiring/

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Haven't read the whole thing but I agree with the gist of it. Borrower is a servant to the lender, and the lender always has the position of power.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Exactly. Some of it is basic stuff but it’s still powerful. To me at least. I’m not sure if there is a video without a bunch of his other theories and that one only... but most people don’t view things that way so what’s common sense to one isn’t always to another.

Link to YouTube:

One of my favorite speeches by him.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

lol The position of power, is from the one that can die tomorrow and that money the bank lent out, can go poof in an instant. And I'd much rather die, with owing the bank money.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Why would you not want to position yourself where you don’t owe anybody anything? If you could, why wouldn’t you? It’s called authentic freedom.

Guess to each is own.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Because I'm a business owner, and I think differently than a normal person would.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Lol, clearly you don’t. Because what one has debt in a business in not debt personally if your smart with what your doing. And if you had enough money where you don’t need to lease something or take out a loan..and just buy it, again why wouldn’t you want that ability? You enjoy paying interest?

It’s just two ways to think about things. I lean towards a warren buffet approach.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

yes actually, I do enjoy paying interest. Because whatever piddly interest I'm paying, doesn't come anywhere close to the value that borrowed money is getting me.

And as far as personal debt, with no interest in investment, and a large savings, sure. No debt is good. Cash is always king. But unless you have an amazing job, and huge savings, and have minimal need to spend money on anything.... Having to sell your car at the last minute, or refinance your house with whatever interest rate is available, assuming you even can do that in whatever state is the reason for you needing that money in a hurry in the first place...

Try getting a loan if you lost your job because you crashed your car and got badly injured.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Oh, you're a billionaire with endless funds? Yeah... I wouldn't pay interest, either, if I were in those shoes. :)

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Do you need a billion dollars not to need a loan? Its a mindset, who cares who I use as a reference. My point is why would you want to be dependent on a bank when you could instead try to make enough money where you don't need a loan. If the thinking is you want to always be dependent, we just view things very very differently.

Honestly what your saying is pathetic to me. In reference to the other person saying its good to pay interest. And actually debt does carry over when you die, so the notion that because you take out loans and are happy paying interest on magical money, at some point someone has to pay... and if everyone didn't, and used your thought process, how would we have banks to offer loans in the first place?

Last thing I'll comment on, the idea that because your a business owner you should be taking out loans, its funny to me. Maybe when your a startup, but if your managing your money properly and are profitable, its called a savings account.

I'm happy with how I view things. Won't comment on this any further.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

How do you think he made enough money to not need loans? BY GETTING LOANS.

The idea that being a business owner, you should take loans. Yeah. where are you getting this savings from? From your 9-5 job? I mean, I guess if you're lucky. But with all this buying car and hose with cash, good luck having a savings.

Sure, if you have a really good savings, and have a business with really good profit. But why would you risk all your cash on it? At least if you fail miserably, you can go into bankruptcy... But the point is.. LOANS ARE CHEAP MONEY. Why are you so worried about it? I mean, if your business is so profitable, you shouldn't be worried at all about taking out a loan, because you should be able to make enough profit to pay that loan off and have money to spare. RIGHT? If you're in a business that doesn't want to expand, don't get a loan. If your business is actually scalable, then loans are exactly the thing you need.

I'm more a fan of Trumps philosophy, as much as people now hate him.
" if I die and the bank owes me money, the bank wins. If I die and I owe the bank money, I win" :)

Sure, debt carries over when you die. If you're a moron and weren't able to separate yourself and your family from your debt.

Paying interest can sound pathetic to you all you want. While I pay my 5% interest on the $30,000 I borrowed, I'll be doubling that $30,000 very shortly. I'll pay the bank their piddly 5%, while I rake in the $10,000's in profits by using their cheap money. The idea of someone not willing to utilize such an obvious commodity, is pathetic to me.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Great, because clearly you aren't even reading what you've been commenting on.

I never said OMG I ALWAYS WANNA OWE THE BANKS MONEY FROM THESE PERPETUAL L04NZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!111

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

haha, this is why I simply stepped back from the thread. There are clearly two parties here regarding debt, and I don't see any point in arguing about it past saying we agree to disagree.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

You agreed earlier? You've since changed your mind? :dance:

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Or are you just speaking of everyone in general?

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I mean, what's wrong with debating, for debating sake? Maybe I'm weird tho, cause I enjoy such things.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Yes, I guess. :noidea:

I conceded your point because I can see the benefits of growing your business with lines of credit. But I can also see the benefits of growing organically without debt. Both sides can be correct depending on the context and the circumstances.

Some would rather not risk our own money with business ventures (the loan party), some of us would rather not risk bankruptcy by getting a loan for something that potentially never makes any money (the no loan party).

I know not what else to say. I like debating as much as the next guy but there are merits to both sides of this discussion so nobody can win, and it's just getting people pissed off.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I fully understand the pros/cons of each side. Was just explaining to the NEVER NO EVIL LOANS peeps, that sometimes loans are very beneficial.

Perfectly sums it up!

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

wait, who is pissed off?

Also, what's worse? Sinking $200,000 of your own money into a business, and it failing, or sinking $200,000 of debt into the business, and having the business go bankrupt? Would you risk the $200,000 cash into something that potentially never makes any money? That sounds a lot more risky than using the banks money. Because, if you're smart, you'll have that $200,000 cash somewhere safe....

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

I deal with cell phones. There was a seller a few years ago gazelle-stores. They were supposedly buying a used iPhone every 8 seconds, they had commercials on TV, eBay feedback 500,000. Great, great service, an 800 number with live customer support, no questions asked moneyback guarantee, etc.......

Not a registered user.

If you have a brick and mortar business you could have fires, robberies, employee theft, etc....

Getting kicked off of eBay only makes you come back stronger. In the real world your store burns down you need to save again or beg family, etc.. An ebay account is worth nothing, just need to take time to start over. We are all learning important lessons cheaper and faster than brick and mortar store owners did 30 years ago. eBay NARU or Paypal limitation is just as harmful as having the police put yellow tape around a real store. Be prepared.

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

[/B]Fair enough, then allow me to entertain you.

Let me quote what your original response to my willingness to upload a motivational video,

“ lol The position of power, is from the one that can die tomorrow and that money the bank lent out, can go poof in an instant. And I'd much rather die, with owing the bank money.”

You my friend are backtracking and contradicting everything you have said.


I said from the start, if you COULD make enough to not be dependent why wouldn’t you? Was I speaking specifically about business? No. I believe people were speaking on using loans/credit cards to buy things they cannot afford.

It’s very easy to look as though you are successful. But reality is, and any self made individual agrees with this or .... well I imagine everyone would, you invest what you have then spend what’s left. You do not spend what you have and invest what’s left. That is the fundamental point of the video and what I was saying.

You said as a starting position who cares because if you died while paying interest on x amount of money owed... your dead. So why try to make as much as you can? Why do anything with that thought process?

Maybe if you have a family, which I don’t, you do it for them. Because yes power can mean your kids kids don’t have to go threw the struggle you had too. With respect to all your other examples, again they’re meaningless to me because for one I already said it’s the mindset not the individual. So saying buffet took loans, I don’t know if this is true but regardless I already said I can see it as a START UP for businesses. Every example you gave was for a start up so what point are you trying to make???

I win. :clap:

Re: Anybody else happy that they were banned ?
 

Yeah, you remind me why I stopped posting on the forum. Lol...you pick the one little part of what I said, to say that. Because everyone who doesn’t have kids is on drugs? Great point!

Little people saying things like that. It’s okay, i understand. Give me a good reason to not waste time posting on a forum.