NFL Season 2013 has begun

mcmx · #**353** 12-23-2013

In the playoffs that Manning won his only SuperBowl, he threw more than double the amount of INTs than TDs. (3 TDs, 7 INTS). I'm sorry but that's another glaringly bad statistic.

Also, Brady constantly has players go in & out the door and adjusts on the fly. They talked about this on the NFL network. You can attach Montana's name to Rice. Manning to Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne. But choosing one for Brady didn't make sense. Welker is the only candidate but he was there for half the time as the previous WRs mentioned, and was just a short 1 dimensional slot guy. Pretty incomparable to the types of WRs Rice, Harrison and Wayne were. Moss was there for 4 years (Brady had him for only 3 because of his season ending injury)

I'm not so sure Manning could win those 2 more championships with the Patriots than Brady. Yet alone, could he win the amount of games the Patriots & Brady won this season despite the injuries mountains of injuries. Statistically, the Patriots D was the worst defence to ever make it to the SuperBowl in 2012. The Patriots were a Welker drop away from winning that game. I guess we'll see this year if Manning can take his own poorly ranked D past the 1st round.

vogeltron · #**354** 12-23-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy D

I like Brady. He has been lucky enough to have players and coaches around him to help him look even better.

Smart and clutch he is good but if Manning were in NE for the last 10 years I can see them winning 5 of the 10 championships.

Manning took Indy to it and yes threw the interception but he did not really have much of a team around him to even get to it.

Everyone else must feel he has done well.

He should win his 5th MVP this season. Brady has 2.

Both are the best of their time and both are talked about being the best of all time.

Peyton Manning had just as good if not better teams in Indy. Especially in the early part of the 2000's when he had Harrison, Wayne and Edgrinn James. However, Manning like always has failed to win in Jan especially in cold weather. We have seen all kinds of QBs like Warner, Steve Young, and Dan Fouts put up crazy numbers playing inside or in domes. If you want to be considered the best you have to be able to win a road game. You also have to win Superbowls.

Peyton Manning is like Dan Marino and Dan Fouts in my book. Fun to watch put points on the board. But if I have to take one QB from this era to win one game. It is Tom Brady no doubt about it.

An0nym0u$ · #**355** 12-23-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy D

I like Brady. He has been lucky enough to have players and coaches around him to help him look even better.

Smart and clutch he is good but if Manning were in NE for the last 10 years I can see them winning 5 of the 10 championships.

Manning took Indy to it and yes threw the interception but he did not really have much of a team around him to even get to it.

You had me thinking Eli until you said that last part! As a big Giants fan (and Eli supporter), I gotta back my franchise QB.

Remember, if Eli didn't beat Brady TWICE, Brady would have 5 rings...and a perfect 19-0 season.

An0nym0u$ · #**356** 12-23-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by vogeltron

But if I have to take one QB from this era to win one game. It is Tom Brady no doubt about it.

I would take the QB that beat him on the biggest stage not once...but twice...ELI!!!

mcmx · #**357** 12-23-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by An0nym0u$

I would take the QB that beat him on the biggest stage not once...but twice...ELI!!!

He beat the worst defense to ever make it to the SuperBowl in 2012. And in 2007 he closed his eyes and chucked the ball downfield for a no-name receiver to somehow catch with the most luck in sports history. I'm convinced he played those games with a horse shoe stuck up his ass lol.

Even after leading the league once again in interceptions, I really hope you wouldn't take Eli over Brady lol

That Giants D has Brady's number though.

vogeltron · #**358** 12-24-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by An0nym0u$

I would take the QB that beat him on the biggest stage not once...but twice...ELI!!!

Those 25 Interceptions this year aren't looking that good. Eli has played well when he actually makes the playoffs. But he is not in that top tier of elite QB's, more in the Terry Bradshaw realm of the QB world. Solid player on some very good teams. Tom Brady has never had losing season. Other than the year he got hurt, he has one season on record as a starter with less than 10 wins. He has the Postseason accolades to go with it as well.

It is Ironic however, Peyton has had trouble beating Brady his entire career and little brother took two Superbowls from him.

rsot · #**359** 12-24-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcmx

If by good game, you mean close, I hope so.

I win $50 as long as Falcons don't lose by more than 24!

Congratz mcmx hah - was a tight game until the late 2nd half when 49ers took over

Sandy D · #**360** 12-24-2013

I was looking at different list of top QBs of all time and noticed not everyone is on the same page so it makes it logical for none of us to think the same.

Many list has Brett Favre on their top 5 all time list and no way is he a top 5 qb of all time.

Manning and Brady would possibly be close and or in the top 5.

Issues are I really like Brady and have for years and he should have more rings as the teams he has guided were loaded with talent. Manning had those good teams early on but they were not Pats loaded up talented teams at all.

Marino would be also in the discussion had he played on a better team. To me he is the best passer ever in my opinion. Quick release, smart and could have had an even better career had Miami had more talent.

Dont forget Montana either.

We have been lucky enough to see Montana, Manning and Brady play and may be 3 of the best QBs ever to play.

vogeltron · #**361** 12-24-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy D

Dont forget Montana either.

We have been lucky enough to see Montana, Manning and Brady play and may be 3 of the best QBs ever to play.

Elway is in my top 5

rsot · #**362** 12-24-2013

Montana and Rice are what got me on the 49ers band wagon when I was young.

John Elway and Dan Marino were brilliant - true

vogeltron · #**363** 12-25-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsot

Montana and Rice are what got me on the 49ers band wagon when I was young.

John Elway and Dan Marino were brilliant - true

Young and Rice were equally as impressive.

rsot · #**364** 12-25-2013

That's true vogeltron - highlights of Rice were on the other day...so many stats

Sandy D · #**365** 12-26-2013

The issue I have is some believe Manning pads his stats but Montana/ Rice and Young/Rice did nothing but design plays around Rice every game.

When you get 15 balls a game tossed at you for years, you are bound to set records.

Rice was very good but I dont think he is the best ever. Montana and Young just were that good. They put the ball in his hands and gave him so many opps to catch the ball.

Never impressed with Elway myself. Dont know why.

vogeltron · #**366** 12-27-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy D

The issue I have is some believe Manning pads his stats but Montana/ Rice and Young/Rice did nothing but design plays around Rice every game.

When you get 15 balls a game tossed at you for years, you are bound to set records.

Rice was very good but I dont think he is the best ever. Montana and Young just were that good. They put the ball in his hands and gave him so many opps to catch the ball.

Never impressed with Elway myself. Dont know why.

It is hard to compare the 90's football players to what the game evolved into today. Back then guys where still getting lit up. I think Steve Young played 4 weeks in a row after suffering a concussion. Those guys that played back then where Gladiators.

Now you see a Gunner put a legal hit on a punter and they fine him like crazy just because the Punter gets hurt. I understand some of the safety precautions but lets not turn this into touch football. The DBs can hardly tough the WRs anymore.

rsot · #**367** 12-27-2013

Missed Thursday night football :( hah

Sandy D · #**368** 12-27-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by vogeltron

It is hard to compare the 90's football players to what the game evolved into today. Back then guys where still getting lit up. I think Steve Young played 4 weeks in a row after suffering a concussion. Those guys that played back then where Gladiators.

Now you see a Gunner put a legal hit on a punter and they fine him like crazy just because the Punter gets hurt. I understand some of the safety precautions but lets not turn this into touch football. The DBs can hardly tough the WRs anymore.

Did you see the DB knock ther 49ers Boldin silly on a play that was on the opposite side of them? He blind sided Boldin and was a dirty hit.

DBs have become head hunters.

I dont want touch football either but todays players are out to hurt someone.

Saints players came to mind as they were getting paid to hurt players.

As far as dirty goes, no one beats the Ravena and Steelers.

An0nym0u$ · #**369** 12-27-2013

I have different take; its not so much dirty play but poor tackling skills that lead to what looks like dirty plays.

Nowadays, defensive players are taught to go after the strip/fumble. For a lot of DEF players, that just means hitting the ball carrier/receiver as hard as you can to jar the ball loose.

There was a lot better form in tackling years ago. Now, all you see are people leading w/ their helmets and don't try to wrap up & tackle.

rsot · #**370** 12-27-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy D

Saints players came to mind as they were getting paid to hurt players.

As far as dirty goes, no one beats the Ravena and Steelers.

Ah the Saints scandal...too true

Sandy D · #**371** 12-27-2013

Something else I see. Same thing happened in baseball.

Players are paid so much money now they really dont have to put out 100% effort anymore.

Get known for being a big hitter or catching a crazy ball and all of a sudden you are worth more money.

Baseball seen it happen. Players not hustling, not running out short fly balls and then find out it dropped in.

Sad that professional sports has paid ( OVERPAID ) players to just show up.

Example would be this guy.

Nnamdi Asomugha to retire as an Oakland Raider after 11 seasons in NFL - ESPN

DB who signed a gazillion dollar contact 2011 and only had 2-3 good years before that and Philly overpaid him. Not one good one year after he signed his contract. Yet they are making him out like he is some kind of amazing DB when he was not at all.

An0nym0u$ · #**372** 12-27-2013

Albert Haynesworth was a huge bust that I remember. Redskins signed him to a 7yr/$100 million contract.

He barely even played due to conditioning issues and clashing w/ coaches.

rsot · #**373** 12-27-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by An0nym0u$

Albert Haynesworth was a huge bust that I remember. Redskins signed him to a 7yr/$100 million contract.

He barely even played due to conditioning issues and clashing w/ coaches.

I remember that signing - what a bogus plan that was.

But - correct me if I'm wrong - if a player doesnt play in NFL, he doesn't get paid right? Unlike other major leagues...or am I incorrect?

An0nym0u$ · #**374** 12-27-2013

Yes, that's partially true rsot. NFL players get cut often and don't necessarily get paid the entire contract they originally sign.

They will get a signing bonus (which is usually guaranteed) and their base salary which is based on their roster status.

If I read correctly, he got $32 mill signing bonus. So over the course of the 7 years, that's $5 mill guaranteed money. The remainder of the contract is based on whether he is on the roster.

If the player gets cut from the roster, he no longer gets that portion. The team saves some money by doing this and also saves some cap relief.

There are of course always exceptions and different clauses in all contracts, but this is just a basic scenario to explain that NFL contracts unlike Baseball and Basketball are not guaranteed.