SSN For USA Marketplaces

[donkeykong2012]

There is a lot of discussions on here about the changes to USA Paypal, and SSN being required for certain actions etc..

As I am in the UK, I am unclear as how it works in the USA.

What puzzles me a little is am I right in thinking PP only asks for the last 4 digits of the SSN?

How can PP verify anything from only 4 digits of the SSN? I am not sure how many digits the SSN even is?

Does this mean PP have direct access to a USA Government Database for verification purposes? Can any private payment processor do this?

It is the privacy vs verification clash that confuses me. Isn't there a conflict of interest issue here somewhere?

Sorry if the above sounds dumb and I am misunderstanding something. The laws in the USA are clearly different to elsewhere.

However, if I do want to target the USA market at some stage it would be very helpful to understand this clearly.

[phaz0rz]

They ask for the last 4 of SSN at certain stages, and they ask for your full SSN at other stages.

The back of my parents' SS card says something like "never give your SS number to any business or government organization other than the social security administration". But, times have changed. Mine doesn't say that. SS numbers are used as a form of ID now and they're included on your credit report. Any time your apply for credit in the USA your SSN is used to verify the creditor is checking the right credit report.

So no they aren't using gov databases, just credit reporting agencies I think. That's why if you give them an invalid tax ID it will stick until it's rejected by the IRS the next year.

[donkeykong2012]

Originally Posted by phaz0rz

They ask for the last 4 of SSN at certain stages, and they ask for your full SSN at other stages.

The back of my parents' SS card says something like "never give your SS number to any business or government organization other than the social security administration". But, times have changed. Mine doesn't say that. SS numbers are used as a form of ID now and they're included on your credit report. Any time your apply for credit in the USA your SSN is used to verify the creditor is checking the right credit report.

So no they aren't using gov databases, just credit reporting agencies I think. That's why if you give them an invalid tax ID it will stick until it's rejected by the IRS the next year.

Thanks for that.

I feel for you guys in the US.

[rsot]

Originally Posted by phaz0rz

They ask for the last 4 of SSN at certain stages, and they ask for your full SSN at other stages.

The back of my parents' SS card says something like "never give your SS number to any business or government organization other than the social security administration". But, times have changed. Mine doesn't say that. SS numbers are used as a form of ID now and they're included on your credit report. Any time your apply for credit in the USA your SSN is used to verify the creditor is checking the right credit report.

So no they aren't using gov databases, just credit reporting agencies I think. That's why if you give them an invalid tax ID it will stick until it's rejected by the IRS the next year.

I called a US person to make sure that delivery had occurred (he requested the call) - immediately he was saying do you need my SSN to verify?

[phaz0rz]

Originally Posted by rsot

I called a US person to make sure that delivery had occurred (he requested the call) - immediately he was saying do you need my SSN to verify?

I hear you. It's scary how willing younger people are to give out their SSN. They're so used to giving it out that they don't care. It used to be a sacred number for people to save until their 60's.

[donkeykong2012]

The Adyen/EBay relationship will be an eye opener.

I imagine there will be a lot of resistance in the States for signup. Even when Paypal is integrated.

The SSN issue could be an issue for stealth. But I imagine there will be some resistance from stealth and non stealth users. Even semi-stealth users!

EBay needs enough voluntary members first before they make it compulsory.

Their strategy seems to be one of convincing everyone that Adyen is inevitable, and hoping the voluntary sign ups are enough to warrant compulsory roll outs.

I am struggling to see why any seller would want to give EBay their SSN, Bank details and anything else along with allowing them to manage payments.

Adyen isn't a formality if enough sellers reject it IMO. I can see nothing but chaos if they force it through!

[phaz0rz]

Unfortunately there's going to be little to no outcry when eBay officially switches to Adyen-only in USA. It's certainly not going to be an event you hear about in the news. Like I was saying earlier everyone in USA is already so used to giving their SSN to every company they deal with that it's not going to ruffle any feathers whatsoever for 90% of sellers.

I am struggling to see why any seller would want to give EBay their SSN, Bank details and anything else along with allowing them to manage payments.

I'm a USA seller and that's not a concern of mine at all. eBay already has all of that info on me from back when eBay and Paypal were the same company.

Now that they are split I don't have any reason to trust eBay less than I trust Paypal or Auth.net.

I think the only people you're going to see complaining are people on this forum, because stealthers are the ones who will be impacted most. Businesses running legitimately on eBay shouldn't have any problems.

[donkeykong2012]

Originally Posted by phaz0rz

Unfortunately there's going to be little to no outcry when eBay officially switches to Adyen-only in USA. It's certainly not going to be an event you hear about in the news. Like I was saying earlier everyone in USA is already so used to giving their SSN to every company they deal with that it's not going to ruffle any feathers whatsoever for 90% of sellers.

I'm a USA seller and that's not a concern of mine at all. eBay already has all of that info on me from back when eBay and Paypal were the same company.

Now that they are split I don't have any reason to trust eBay less than I trust Paypal or Auth.net.

I think the only people you're going to see complaining are people on this forum, because stealthers are the ones who will be impacted most. Businesses running legitimately on eBay shouldn't have any problems.

Judging from the comments here I am not too sure....

https://www.ecommercebytes.com/C/blo....html#comments

https://www.ecommercebytes.com/C/blo....html#comments

[phaz0rz]

Most of the complaints I've seen there and on the eBay community forums are from sellers complaining that their sales dropped dramatically once they accepted the Adyen invite, because Paypal hasn't been integrated into Adyen payments yet. eBay didn't make sellers aware that Paypal wouldn't be a payment option for buyers if they accepted the beta Adyen invite, so I've seen a lot of sellers pissed about that.

I see a lot of comments on there saying "I'm just gonna quit selling when they force me to switch" but I'm not seeing any arguments explaining why. There was a ton of uproar when they forced everyone to stop using Selling Manager and start using Seller Hub. It's natural for people to get comfy and resist change. But if you want to keep your business moving forward you have to roll with the punches and adapt. Every year there's a new hurdle. This guy on ecomm bytes said it best :

This is the way the wind is blowing, you either adapt to it or break.

For years on here everyone was complaining about the Chinese sellers. Chinese sellers were easily able to make USA stealth accounts and undercut anyone selling in the US. Now that eBay is making it impossible for foreigners to operate on USA accounts, that's a problem too apparently.

Forum members keep hoping, but they aren't going to be abandoning the Adyen project at this point. They've already invested millions redesigning eBay's front and backend. Managed payments will ultimately stop a lot of the fraud that's on eBay today and make eBay more profitable. Sellers that can't handle it will go away and other more adaptable sellers will pick up the slack and start selling the first sellers items in order to fill the void.

Anyway, I'm rambling at this point. It won't be so bad.

[treysupreme]

The patriot act really made giving your SSN necessary for everything. The irony of the name "patriot act" seems to be a cruel joke the government played on us.

"Lets call it something that implies freedom but actually takes away a lot freedom." Honestly, today's young people are too worried about finding things to be offended by to care about the erosion of freedom.

Back to eBay though, I do think a lot of US sellers are gonna find ways to phake SSNs or use ones that aren't theirs. People who never would have considered it no probably will.

[ddm50]

Originally Posted by treysupreme

The patriot act really made giving your SSN necessary for everything. The irony of the name "patriot act" seems to be a cruel joke the government played on us.

"Lets call it something that implies freedom but actually takes away a lot freedom." Honestly, today's young people are too worried about finding things to be offended by to care about the erosion of freedom.

Back to eBay though, I do think a lot of US sellers are gonna find ways to phake SSNs or use onIes that aren't theirs. People who never would have considered it no probably will.

It's crazy, on another forum guy is selling SSN's, I'm really curious on how intelligent he is and does he know that it's identity theft lol

[treysupreme]

Originally Posted by ddm50

It's crazy, on another forum guy is selling SSN's, I'm really curious on how intelligent he is and does he know that it's identity theft lol

Yeah there are SSNs and PayPal accounts with SSNs attached pretty readily available. People don't generally view it as identity theft (even though it is) because no one is getting hurt unless you go over the 200/$20K. Rationalizing.

But this is where PayPal stealth is headed. You either do that or you get out of the game

[phaz0rz]

Originally Posted by treysupreme

Yeah there are SSNs and PayPal accounts with SSNs attached pretty readily available. People don't generally view it as identity theft (even though it is) because no one is getting hurt unless you go over the 200/$20K. Rationalizing.

But this is where PayPal stealth is headed. You either do that or you get out of the game

Or, rather than turning to fraud, you could setup a legitimate business and use eBay managed payments, maybe?