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Hey, Im with you on this. I have been trying to hammer this message home for months now and still get the same posts daily on the same issues.

You dont understand this stuff in the simplest sense. If you were to talk to a tax adviser, business attorney, etc, They will not give the same advice to each person that walks in. A business is a VERY complicated thing that people pass off as a joke. Most people that are in business for themselves hate it. talk to someone that owns their own business and ask them how much vacation time they have or how much sick leave they have. Or when the last time they went on vacation.

My point is that the advisers give personalized help for each business. No 2 businesses are the same in any way. you have real estate, rental agreements, stock on hand, stock on credit, credit ratings, sales tax payments and income tax payments to make quarterly, insurance, etc, etc, etc to worry about.

You guys that just want to sell and collect cash are seeing your easy lifestyle end very fast in front of your eyes.

Things are changing. If you want to "hustle" which is what many of you are really doing then split up accounts and spread sales, that is all there is to do. VERY simple.

If you want to have a less stressful business life then do what they ask when they want a business tax ID. If not then keep doing what you are doing. its not hard to understand. you guys just want a quick fix and its not there and wont be.

IF Stealth is what you want and I assume it is since some are on this site for that reason only then the TIN is not for you at all.

I have rambled enough on this but trying to make this point on dozens of posts is getting old when only about 5% of you are getting how things work.

stealth accounts will prevail no doubt.If the people on the amazon boards and some on these boards say that they were paying taxes all these years they are full of SH!T.Only if you a real business Then you payed taxes. But the average3rd party seller No Fkn way! Why would you report income that was not traceble.and I feel the govt are crooks just beat us down some more . The govt is so good that they have to hide there laws thousands of pages deep in bs laws that no one will read. and come on do they actually really read their own bs. just drag us behind a truck some more!! what will be next tax the air we breath..
That is real good. There will be a way with stealth but it will now be quite involved ..

the us is now officially a cesspool thanks to the current administration..:boom::boom:

Cool, You said what I have been wanting to say about some stealth users for years now. 100% correct.

Income is very traceable(The Accounts that you want Traced). Amazon allows you each year to download pdf files for income earned that whole year. Plus you keep receipts. gas logs, and etc. But mind you I travel to Pawn Shops, I shop local games stores, garage sales, yard sales, etc.( make yard sale owners also give me receipts for everything I bought whether its on a plain sheet of paper or not its a receipt showing what I bought. This is what I take to my accountant every year. This is all calculated and written off. Mind you the traceable part did work in my favor on Amazon because I carried only the PDF files from the accounts that I did not sell China products on and only carried the ones for which I had my receipts from the above shopping places I went to. China Accounts never went to my tax guy. So this is how I was able to do taxes every year.

Will have to go back to eBay exclusively now. Being that my amazon accounts will be no use to me after dec 26th. I would like to completely legit. But all my real info amazon account has already suspended years ago. Wonder if I could use my middle and last name only on my EIN #.

Accounts wont last as you all Know Even legit accounts go under. It is well known and proven. Say you use all your real info and then after 4-6 months amazon cuts you loose. It happens everyday and it happened to me plenty even with 100% feedback and no claims. So it does not matter.It is up to amazon. Then you are done and you have exhausted your options.
there will be a way around it for sure

EXACTLY PRECISE!!! I don't understand when people are telling us to go LEGIT!! I can sum this up easy.."BEEN THERE DONE THAT!!" Amazon is a different Beast. On Ebay you can easily go Legit and last for a while doing so. All it takes is one person to say anything and I mean anything about you or Amazon which happens a lot and your TOAST!! Amazon breeds a different species of customer base than Ebay. These customers are One-of-a-Kind!!

You know what I am not worried because we don't have to go "Legit", we don't have to succumb to Amazon, at least not yet?? I know a solution will surface soon I am confident!! But patience is key right now.

Hey guys I really should not be worried....I found a site that that's exploding with money to make. I made a $10,000 sale last week which profits me around $7100 a sale. ALL LEGIT of course. Well my account was immediately put on hold after the sale. I showed tracking and WALAHH.....money in my bank account this morning....Exactly $10,173. Boy this is the BEST SITE since Slice Bread. My husband said....HAH!! & your worried about Amazon??? LOL!!! So guys I know we all love Amazon but REALLY....had I made that sale on their site I would have been put off Money on "Hold" while they think about am I worthy enough to trust or release the funds. Now mind you I only been on this site for 2 weeks TOPS...Try that with Amazon, Ebay, or Paypal?? So look around guys we should not be depending on these sites so much when you can do what I just did?? I hope this windfall for me shines a glimmer of hope for you all.

P.S Before you guys even think about pm'ing me about this site.....NOT A FAT CHANCE!! My son found it for me after he got disgusted with the way Amazon and Ebay has been treating me. He spent weeks researching different sites so you can too. Kids are ASSETS you know!!

This far I got in my thought process. I'm sure this is the story for a lot of us. I mean that is why we are on a stealth forum,no?
Amazon suspended me a couple of years ago. I have stealth since then,obviously completely made up info. So this stealth will be until Dec 26th, after that 88.
Next year I open a business and request a tax id number and open another account. Follow the stealth steps for new Windows account, IP,Mac etc. Name I have a fairly common name so I can use it.
Address I will use my friend address to register the business and I will give that to Amazon.
I dont see the problem with that,if I keep sales under 20 I will be ok. If not, I will pay taxes.
Any thoughts?

Stealth accounts arent dead in general. You can have a stealth account, but you need to make it last, and that is done by playing the game the right way and not selling foo-foos. Sooner or later if you are creating stealths and they keep getting shut down, you will run out of EIN/SSN/TAX ID options which you NEED to make them last. I have had solid stealth accounts for many many years, but they are all clean, real tax info, real banking, verified, established, the whole 9 yards. Where people are running into trouble is not thinking long term. They think short term, and before you know it you are waist deep in issues and your account is history. Nothing lasts without a solid plan, and vision ahead, GUARANTEED.

Like I said before you can complain all you want, and not play the game, and you will be sitting on the sidelines. Or you can pay the taxes on the 150k+ and keep playing the game. No way in hell did I pay taxes before on the 150k+ a year or more. But now I will now, because I want to keep playing the game. Change will ether make people jump for joy or freak out and want to murder someone. In this case, it is murder someone.

I have read all the posts here and maybe I missed something.

The reason I am on this site is because I got screwed over WITH MY REAL INFO by customers.

Only stuff I sell is legit products that I ship myself. Things like video games, dvds, board games.

I see posts about people going legit and setting up an account to use for good, but I am physically not able to do that.

Any advice on this? Im assuming most people were legit to begin with. That option is out the window.

Has anyone actually gone through the "interview process" they say is required?

They are only asking sellers with over 50 transactions. Stealth will still be relevant

50 transactons what crap,its suppose to be 200 transactions not 50.................

Like i said It does not matter real or stealth when amazon gets a piece of lint stuck to their b@lls you are gone. whether 2 feedbacks and 100 sales or 5000 feedbacks and 100,000 sales. It is a game. I will play it as long as i can. where there is a will there is away.

wow, so many of you are not bright.

With asking for info this will drive online prices up . No one will sell penny items anymore and id say that the average dvd will rise in price . No more lowballing. since a lot of sellers will be stealth and have to watch how they sell.

There is a reason why everyone is stealth!! So to say be legit is being"hypocritical". That is why this website is here!!People that had there accounts with real info and had been suspended.

Ok I am going to be logical ." Since we are simple for being stealth, mind you having already used our real names and have been suspended I guess when certain users are telling us to go Legit it must mean the following:

A.) Use a friend or family member's "LEGIT" info that way we can use a real SSN# or TIN# thus screwing them with the IRS among other things like their credit.

B.) Hopefully Amazon have forgotten or better yet scratched our real names off their "Blacklist" thus allowing us a second Chance.....NOT!!

C.) Forget this stealth thing altogether and that this Stealth thing including this website never even existed and it was all a part of our Imagination.

Maybe someone else might chime in with other suggestions.

only thing I can think of so far that might work is to go combo legit and partial stealth. Partial stealth for amazon after Dec. 26th - legit to avoid issues with the IRS.

Try getting a box at a mail boxes etc. type place in a different town than your original suspended account that will be a regular looking street address as opposed to a PO Box address and set up a stealth account based on this address using a variation of your real name so it won't be totally out of line with your new TIN. Use your middle name as your first name or something along those lines. If your name that got suspended is William Joseph Smith call yourself Liam Smith or Joe Smith. Use stealth everything else. That may be enough to fool amazon.

Once you get back on amazon and start making sales apply for an EIN with your real IRS info and the new box address as the business address.

If you are making over 20K you are simply going to have pay your taxes. if you are making under 20K you are gong to have to think long and hard it about it.

I know paying taxes on under 20K is the right thing to do and the smart thing to do but it worries me if all the sudden you start reporting this income in 2012 it will trigger the IRS to start looking backwards for more. If there is no 1099-K form going to the IRS it might be better to let sleeping dogs lie.

you are right. amazon using the 50 threshold is simply a way to weed out stealth sellers and sellers who have multiple accounts using other family members.

That is what I read on the seller soapbox. So that amazon can weed out the if you sold before and. Scum bags!. well i guess I will be busy creating a lot of accounts as they creep up to the magic number. ill walk away and start new.

also there will be no more penny booksellers. amazon will have squashed that with the 50 transactions,so that they will have people buying there kindle!!

I also keep my own inventory. I believe this will hit drop shippers the hardest. My biggest competition comes from drop shippers (no offense intended to anyone) so I am wondering how many will be still standing once the dust clears.

I have a question....
A seller who exceeds 50 sales, needs to provide tax info to Amazon. If they exceed 200(I have exceeded 200) the IRS becomes involved.
Amazon states anyone who does comply with the new regulations will have their accounts suspended until they comply.
My question is:
If I do not comply, and Amazon suspends me, Will they still come after me for taxes?
In other words, is there a risk of Amazon sending the information they have on me into the IRS, if I do not submit the required forms?

Taxes are still going to be payable, regardless of what happens.

Has that sunk in yet? :boink:

I haven't been kicked off amazon. With a run and gun account you could do say 49 items on 10 different accounts right? That would avoid the TIN?

That is what I will be doing..I have no choice I have exhausted every option years ago.

the reporting threshold is 200 transactions and 20K in gross sales. If you have not made 20K in gross sales and get suspended I would guess you would be OK.

I've exceeded 20,000 in sales in my good account. My bath would have been far worse, if not for the fact my others sales were spread over stealth accounts. As much as I am sorry to see those accounts go, I can always create more. If I understand correctly, I can continue to sell (until Dec) on them, as long as I keep below the 200 item limit?
If that being the case, I can continue to sell on them and leave my good account alone. This may help me out as I believe a lot of my competition will disappear.
MY markup is good, so I'll continue with stealth and the one account which is free and above board. I buy my own inventory, so those accounts may be of more then one use.
I'd like to thank the users of this forum for their sound advice.

I'd also have to chime in that this issue cries out for some guidance of some kind here, even if it's just sharing stories of approaches taken and what seemed to work and what didn't. The problem could be as much of a threat to some as suspensions.

Also, many people out there might not be too far above that $20K threshold, so consulting with professionals, while advisable, doesn't always get done (at least as a first resort) because of cost.

It seems that Amazon is setting an unreasonably low threshold at 50 transactions, given how many low-dollar items they have for sale. You could easily do that many and still be under $1,000, when the IRS is really looking at $20K and up. Seems as if Amazon is using this as an excuse to collect SSNs, shut down accounts and otherwise become very controlling. They deserve to be "rewarded" with lots of administrative headaches and complaints, as I'd bet the majority of those at 50+ transactions are still neither $20K in revenues nor full-time. You can easily hit that just doing it for side income. It could be a real revenue loser if it runs off sellers.

Iam going to hit and run. I have no choices.

I have not reached 200 items yet but how do I confirm this exactly...

This situation and how it plays out, will be very interesting indeed.:-)

The things I'm looking forward to are the challenge and the rewards. I plan on being one of the "crafty" sellers left to absorb the undoubtedly 'increased profits' due to marked up prices. As we know, this increased profit margin will be in direct result of 'less craftier" or "lazier" sellers giving up.:-)

The fact that Amazon asks for TIN instead of SSN should tell us something. This IRS thing is a REQUIREMENT and Amazon is doing damage control because they do not want to lose a lot revenue as a result of this. They are quite aware of the many fraudulent accounts active on there site. They play with us like mice, eliminating this one or that one for the overall good of the business. It isnt about the customers or the sellers more than it is about Amazon's bottom line.

Think about it like this; If you get caught with thousands in stolen merchandise and the victim from which it was stolen doesn't come forward, the law states, "No Victim, No Crime". Amazon operates in a similar sense. 'Let the mice do what they will as long as we profit from it.' That is why it only takes one customer to complain to get you shut down! Amazon knows its business depends a lot on bogus accounts and they consider this in their calculations.

The math is simple. AmazonGhost and other books like it, has taught thousands the tricks to getting back on amazon. Many are using these techniques to sell bogus merchandise, thus creating a more watered down marketplace. This method is pissing off thousands more customers.

So, suffice it to say, once the determined sellers find the loopholes they can rest in knowing that a lot of their competition will have been successfully weeded out. Why share the secrets if the end result will be Amazon evolving again?

I can guarantee that Aspkin hasn't conveyed every thing he knows about Amazon in his book. Him and those closest to him may reap the benefits of that. (Wish I was one) Even If it is by having a more competitive 'edge' selling on Amazon or being able to 'update' the ebook for more $$. It is a smart tactic that allows unlimited avenues for new gimmicks and is used in all 'for profit business':-)

Don't get me confused I am not complaining and I don't knock it at all! I say if you work hard, you should enjoy the fruits of your labor. And I can definitely appreciate anybody who resents the ones who work little and reap the benefits of this forum. So, It is now 'crunch time'. This is going to separate the hard workers from the coattail riders'. Good luck to us all!:-)

'FOCUSED ON BECOMING A MASTER STEALTH BOMBER'

Just do a search for transactions and make the range for the last year.

Amazon anounced this in 2009. But I never thought they would require sellers that have over 50 transactions to report.

I was averaging 150 a year with an average intake of $3500. I wonder what will happen when I don't give them my tax info, besides getting banned. I never filed a 1090 because my profit was only like $500 in a year, haha.

I'm stealth on eBay, non-stealth on Amazon. Am under the $20K on eBay (though I'm getting the e-mail nags), but over it on Amazon.

I've always reported revenues and paid taxes on the money, even for stealth accounts, since 2002 (when the revenues first hit 4 figures).

I'm more concerned with Amazon having my SSN than I am with issues with the IRS, though this is shaping up to be a breakout year and I s'pose that alone could get them more curious about previous years.

My products have a small VERO risk, i.e. maybe 1 to 1.5 average complaints a year on eBay (across a 500+ item inventory) that drags the "compliance" metric to medium occasionally but hasn't sunk the account since that account's inception in 2006. If there's a tolerance factor on eBay it's within that (and the complaints may not be legit, but I don't think I'll ever get the complainer to see it that way).

Feels like walking through a very sparse minefield, and I'm not sure how much I gain from giving something other than SSN to Amazon. If the worst happens and the Amazon account goes down, would it be easier to get back with a different TIN, EIN or other number?

I also would have great difficulty churning the accounts at a 50 threshold, as I'd need 2 a week for some weeks. (Average sale might be $12 in final value). Would be nice to drop a widget in a bubble mailer at $100 each, but it seems that's what everyone's trying to do.

Very true,

So,I am new the the blocked world and working on setting up my 1st "stealth" account. I would like to use the slow and stead approach as I have legitimate product to sell,so I will have to comply with the TIN/EIN as I would like to be on long enough to have such problems (LOL) I was wondering if I used my husbands info is that an option ? Also, would be selling same items as before-has anyone had issues with this?

i have one good account (non stealth) and a couple of stealth. The stealth are disposable and can be replaced. The new tax regs suck, but I believe I can find a good use for the stealth accounts. I buy my inventory and have my own shipping. I will get a receipt for my yearly shipping and purchasing. I should be able to declare these amounts as inventory and shipping cost for the non stealth account. This would be a considerable deduction. I would appreciate any advice, from the more astute sellers....
btw..ugly fish, I would be very careful about listing the exact same items.

Thanks- I was thinking of starting with a new line and and in as I go the things I sold before.

So the whoppin' 30% taxes will only not be payable when a TIN is given, in the same automatic style Amzn reportedly takes it from international dropshippers?

Or payable only when a TIN is given, by which time it's left to each dropshipper to declare his or her own taxes?