Account take over: stealth check

[murdered_by_ebay]

most likely everything would be done electronically , it is however questionable what they are going to do about millions of small sellers. it is barely possible to investigate everyone

for example germany has had such a system for years where all details are sent to the state. actual investigations take place there with sellers who have a certain volume of sales

by the way it is also questionable if tax can be charged on everyone who make more than 2000 pounds per year on turnover. eventually this turnover can come from anything , if you sell your used stuff from home you do not owe tax even if it is worth 10000 pounds , someone would have to investigate. on 2-3 million people? I doubt , investigating someone for a turnover of a few thousand pounds would most likely cost more than any tax collected so that it is likely that everyone would be reported but only a small portion would get a reaction

for what I know ebay are already sending information to various tax authorities and have been doing it for years

[sam999]

Originally Posted by Hank

It is, I simply do not trust browser technology when a new user takes that issue out of the equation. It just a more disciplined approach IMO.

How many ebay accounts are you planning on running on the same machine?

Thanks for clarifying, all I wanted to know was if there was some other reason relating to browser fingerprinting etc I wasn't aware of.

Well I've created 6 in 6 different Chrome profiles. I can see how it may be easy to miss and forget a particular Chrome user is minimised in the background though so I'll do it the user account method.

[Hank]

Originally Posted by murdered_by_ebay

most likely everything would be done electronically , it is however questionable what they are going to do about millions of small sellers. it is barely possible to investigate everyone

for example germany has had such a system for years where all details are sent to the state. actual investigations take place there with sellers who have a certain volume of sales

by the way it is also questionable if tax can be charged on everyone who make more than 2000 pounds per year on turnover. eventually this turnover can come from anything , if you sell your used stuff from home you do not owe tax even if it is worth 10000 pounds , someone would have to investigate. on 2-3 million people? I doubt , investigating someone for a turnover of a few thousand pounds would most likely cost more than any tax collected so that it is likely that everyone would be reported but only a small portion would get a reaction

for what I know ebay are already sending information to various tax authorities and have been doing it for years

It's not a question of investigating millions of people and charging tax, it's a question of making some sellers accountable, as I said earlier, Amazon are already doing it for those selling new goods, those selling used goods are not scrutinised as much. It would be very easy indeed for ebay to copy their model and HMRC simply sit back and wait for new 'customers' to role in.

HMRC would literally have to do nothing, those that voluntarily declare are easy pickings, those that decide to pack it in means buyers have to use tax paying sellers. Win Win.

I'm surprised ebay haven't already implemented the Amazon model, it would delight HMRC and and keep the platform sweet in their eyes.

That said, ebay might do nothing other than supply seller data and make HMRC do all the work, I'd be very surprised if they chose this option.

In any event, this is an exercise in tracking down tax-dodgers. If you owe no tax, you pay no tax.

Lets see what the imminent results of the consultation are and then we can speculate further.

[Nimble]

The consultation period ended in October 2021, over a year ago, since then nothing concrete has been announced.

HMRC usually like to give a long notice period for tax purposes, therefore I believe this will not happen in early 2023.

I have a friend working in the tax department of HMRC, he is not aware of anything internally announced in terms of investigations regarding this, on the contrary, HMRC has stopped recruiting extra workers for the tax department.

Also, ebay wouldn't want to lose their sellers, without sellers they have no income, that's why they haven't introduced features as strict as amazon and will do the minimum required to comply.

On an even playing field, I believe ebay would lose out to the giant that is Amazon, prime video, prime music, free next day shipping, if you're a prime member. I am personally a prime member because of their video service, and since then I have never purchased anything from ebay because of next day delivery even for a Sunday on some items.

ebay know this and they know they need to make their platform easily accessible to sellers to compete with amazon, that's why they would like to stay away from strict measures as long as possible.

[Hank]

Originally Posted by Nimble

Also, ebay wouldn't want to lose their sellers, without sellers they have no income, that's why they haven't introduced features as strict as amazon and will do the minimum required to comply.

How many worthwhile sellers do you think they'd lose? Lets not forget this is about clamping down on tax-dodgers so it stands to reason it would be businesses operating as private sellers.

In any event, it's not for them to decide, it's going to be a statutory requirement for them to disclose sellers and their turnover. That would be the minimums they could do and that alone would spook tax-dodgers into going legit or quitting - and there's nothing ebay could do about it.

It's going to happen sooner rather than later. HMRC will know how Amazon operate and could well 'encourage' ebay to follow suite.

IMO ebay will do everything asked of them and probably some more, they know what's good for them.

[sam999]

Wow so I just found out my family members account which I just converted into a sellers account has 700/35000 limits straight off. Is this typical or am I extremely lucky, it seems crazy good.

[samspalace]

Originally Posted by sam999

Wow so I just found out my friends account which I just converted into a sellers account has 700/35000 limits straight off. Is this typical or am I extremely lucky, it seems crazy good.

This is not lucky at all this depends on the persons credit history so if you just created an account in your friends name with their permission and they have good credit history eBay will give you good limits.

You would want to change the account over in your name when asked for ID or use your friends ID if they let you.

If it’s completely verified then you might never be asked for ID but with tax laws etc it’s best to get it transferred over to you eventually.

[rsot]

Originally Posted by samspalace

You would want to change the account over in your name when asked for ID or use your friends ID if they let you.

If it’s completely verified then you might never be asked for ID but with tax laws etc it’s best to get it transferred over to you eventually.

Not exactly the easiest to change an account over to a different ID though - just a thought

[Nimble]

Originally Posted by sam999

Wow so I just found out my family members account which I just converted into a sellers account has 700/35000 limits straight off. Is this typical or am I extremely lucky, it seems crazy good.

Yes it's normal, a friend opened a new business account couple months ago, and the limits were 1000/10,000, but go slowly as he was hit with a lot of documents to provide because his total sales hit 1900 in the first week.

Even with high limits don't sell to quickly for the first couple of months otherwise bots will put a restriction due to safety concerns.

[angryatebay]

Originally Posted by samspalace

Yes I completely agree I believe one day in the future this will go ahead if not in January 2023 it’s only a matter of time. I think we only need to wait till October 22nd until they announce what will be happening.

https://www.ey.com/en_gl/tax-alerts/...ital-platforms

Following a recent consultation on the implementation of the OECD’s Model ‘Reporting rules for digital platforms’, the UK Government has decided that the new rules will start from 1 January 2024. This new date is intended to give platforms and their advisors time to prepare for the implementation of the new rules, with collection of information starting from 1 January 2024 and submission of the first reports due by the end of January 2025.

Further, HMRC has said that it is currently considering the many comments and issues that have been raised by the consultation respondents. HMRC is aiming to publish the Government’s response to the consultation, draft regulations giving details of the new rules, and an update on interactions with European Union (EU) rules in this area (referred to as DAC71) this summer. HMRC has said that it will also be engaging with platforms and their advisors before the new rules come into effect.

-------------------

Looks like this is delayed for now....

[Hank]

^^^

Certainly going to have a big impact on stealth accounts, never mind legitimate ones who are 'trading under the radar'.

I've already had a message from Amazon EU that it's being implemented, for all intents and purposes with immediate effect.

[auratkachakkar]

I havnt put any blocks on my emails it’s very rare I log into them tho. If your going to use your email linked to eBay regularly then to be safe it would be best to block the images. I’ve never used outlook for eBay tho only yahoo and gmail as previously mentioned.

[auratkachakkar]

I've already had a message from Amazon EU that it's being implemented, for all intents and purposes with immediate effect.
mobdro 2022