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How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be back
 

Think it's safe to post about it now....

If you search managed payment's restricted items, you'll see a list. If you list those items then you can opt out of managed payments. First account was asked to do managed payments 2 years ago, I listed $5 Starbucks gift cards (not allowed at the time with MP) for $4.75 and emailed delivered them. Sold about 20 of them, called management payments, they feed you the same bs "it's required" but after talking to supervisor they send an internal request to opt out. Worked on all accounts, but the first account I opted out of today is now requiring MP.

Currently only restricted item is virtual currency, which was the only thing restricted 6 months ago when I opt-ed out my last account. On that last account I received email saying my virtual currency listing is removed because they are not allowed on MP. Called MP who said they don't opt out any more if you sell restricted items (virtual currency) ebay will just remove those listing instead of opting out.



Why I don't think MP will be required....
(1) Why eBay is doing MP? Easy, although it's profits are increasing, eBay's market share is decreasing and decreasing bad. For example, if you sell clothes 10 years ago, eBay is really your only options. Today there are tons of other websites (poshmark, grailed, etc.). Shareholders care about income, and this is eBay's way of increasing income of a shrinking market space - by increasing fees from 10% to ~13%, almost 30% increase.
(2) Why SSN and bank verification? Don't listen to eBay "law requires it". Reason is simple, Paypal doesn't require it, if you have a negative $500 balance on paypal, could give paypal the middle finger and paypal will have to eat the cost. SSN is required to ding someone's credit. Bank access is required if you owe money, you give ebay's hands permission to dip into your account to take it.

If you put (1) and (2) together, it would make logical sense for eBay to charge every seller 13% fees but not require MP and tell sellers if you want PayPal, you can use PayPal, but you'll have to pay PayPal fees too.... then again eBay isn't the most logical. Problem is the average user isn't willing to prove SSN and allow ebay's hands access into their checking account, sure business sellers "have to" if they want to keep an eBay business, but I think a lot of the smaller/average user will turn away.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

interesting take on this. If you go on reddits ebay subsection, you will see tons of sellers writing they have closed their ebay accounts due to MP, and these are consistent sellers. For your average joe selling crap from around his house, no shot will they give ebay access to their banks (too many instances of ebay being breached), and the ssns.
I do see their profits falling hard, and them rethinking their use of MP. They arent etsy, if you open an etsy store your a pro seller. Ebay is the digital garage sale. So i do see a possibility of the option to use paypal coming back.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Maybe 20% of sellers didn't do MP, but mostly small sellers so really only affects 5% of ebay's bottom line, but MP increases ebay's fees by 30%, so overall increase in profit.

problem is down the road, small sellers won't sign up for eBay and what I sell (mostly clothes), there is good other market places (grailed, poshmark, etc).

It's like selling a junk car and putting a warranty on it, sure sells are great now, but down the road when you are repairing the cars it doesn't look great. Think the executives at ebay are just collecting stock now and will dump and leave it to the next group of executives to clean up the mess

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

while I doubt that paypal will be back , I do not have any doubt that ebay will get a serious growth problem after the dust settles down with MP

the reasons are not just closure of countless stealth accounts but also ruthless suspensions of new accounts , limits to which banks and currencies can be used , kicking out certain types of items , mass suspensions of existing sellers with genuine docs and more.

such a strategy will not allow ebay to have any significant growth once MP is up and running. They want to be like amazon but they can't be

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

I keep seeing around people saying eb wants to be like amz.
What does it mean? In which way want to be like amz?
I don’t have amz account. How amz is similar to mp? How they check new acc?

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

being like amazon means essentially kicking out small sellers , restricting what can be sold , who can sell what and where you can sell from.

amazon has been running this for several years and I can tell from my own experience that the selection went down and prices went up. ebay is a lot cheaper than amazon for many goods.

it works fine for amazon because they sell their own items as well and are active in many different area of business. on ebay this can only lead to stagnation and eventually loss of loads of buyers to the competition

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

I agree.
New sellers (not stealth ones) signing up for ebay are encountering a request for their SSN/DOB - information they never had to provide anyone with this type of service before. It is such a violation of privacy and offers so much opportunities for harmful impact down the road that I think a great many sellers will think twice before they agree to provide such information - especially when there are so many other options out there.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

the SSN issue is limited to the US , ebay have been destroying sellers from many countries though. The disturbing thing about this is not the verification but the fact that it is done by amateurs and most likely planned and ordered by amateurs as well because they do not check docs / items / business parctices but suspend at will.

this is a chicken which will come home to roost , sooner or later the additional profits from MP will become "standard" profits and after that they will get stagnation due to lack of sources for more. many of the destroyed business will never recover by the way.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

so sad but true

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Many of the small sellers wont want to give the SS number or bank account, I have seen this on youtube where people are quitting ebay because its became a hassle. One guy said its just not fun anymore for the small seller.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Where there is pain and sorrow, blossoms a new kind of way. eBay will never be Amazon. And that will be the final nail in the coffin when they realize copying someone else is fail. The only way to stay is to make your own ideas and way. eBay is basically copying mercari but asking for ssn and literally suspending everyone which honestly im so happy they are suspending everyone. The day I see eBay burn will probably be one of the best days of my entire peasant life.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Amazon is a whole different animal than eBay.
They have their own CC processor but the whole game on amazon is still very different.

I don't see how eBay can be like amazon unless they gut themselves and rebuild from scratch with a DAMN good plan.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

ebay won't burn but they will have to take a very heavy hit to their profits from fees and lose loads of buyers to amazon once the new system settles down. the main difference between amazon and ebay is that ebay need loads of third party sellers in order to maintain it's status as major flee market of the world while amazon can concentrate on own sales and on professional sellers like a major mall of world.

mall and flee market - these 2 things can co-exist. but once the flee market decides to become a second mall buyers will start migrating to the other (better) mall

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Interesting.

One thing for sure, good sellers should make more money with less competition.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Every time ebay makes changed you get a few who claim 'this is one move too far and they are doomed'.

There's been some changes which dwarf MP in respect to how business is done yet they're still here and growing.

MP will become the new norm. New sellers will see it as the norm and sign up.

I've never understood why folk are worried about positive change. If you're a good seller you should welcome anything which improves the site and buyer appeal.

...and to suggest paypal will be back is beyond ridiculous.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Youtube is one way of ppl venting - to each his own

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

tell that to the people who got suspended with completely legitimate accounts or who can not open a new legitimate account

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

How many do you think we're talking about. A tiny tiny number I'll wager. Anyway, MP has, in the main, been widely welcomed and if a few have been suspended because of it something tells me there's a good reason. ;)

Like I said, if you think the meltdown over MP is bad you clearly weren't a seller when, in the space of a matter of a couple of years, they made paypal compulsory, removed negative feedback for sellers, made business sellers display their details and made countless 'private' sellers convert to businesses in a 'levelling up' purge. Some we saying that ebay would be dead before the end of the decade - yet here we are getting in a flap about something as trivial as how we get paid.

Trust me, the perceived damage done by a few disgruntled stealthers over MP is almost insignificant.

Each generation of sellers has it's issues. The next generation will have theirs but MP wont be one of them.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Completely 100% accurate...well said

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

well said but not corresponding to reality because loads of people with genuine docs are caught up and it is not about stealthers anymore. I know for a fact that ebay suspend most if not all new accounts of people who already have established accounts on ebay and try to open new ones with same details. this means that the suspensions take place at will and there is no investigation

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Totally agree I’ve had this on real accounts opening second and you get a permanent suspension for no apparent reason right of the bat.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

it also goes further with countless people getting some of their established long running shops shut down for "security risks" but at the same time the rest of the shops continues running.

all this means that these suspensions do not check whether person in question is already known to ebay , they also don't checks docs etc. , the suspensions take place at will. same applies to the customer support where the reps decided within 1-2 minutes whether someone can be reinstated. I will never believe they do any investigation within this time , many of them do not even speak english properly

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

One thing everyone fails to realize, it's a sales platform, not seller platform.
One has to accept the things they can not change.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

I agree.
New today - standard tomorrow.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

What ever the case may be.. I LOVE Ebay MP!! Its the Best thing that every happened to ebay well from my point of view/situation. I hope its here to stay hahaha :bounce:

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

(1) Ebay's problem with Managed Payments isn't that it's bad for stealth, that is our problem. Problem is average Joe is NOT going to give SSN and ebay access to his bank in order to sell some old books/clothes/toys laying around the house. I take back "PayPal will back" in my post and probably better to say for personal sellers (say less than 25 or 50 sales a year), they don't require SSN.

(2) I went to my buying account and saw feedback for a year ago, almost half of the sellers have "no longer a registered user" next to their name. I went back 5 years ago when I made account, almost 90% says "no longer a registered user". Honest question, has any one here ever been been suspended from anything else in their life??
Did gmail ban you? What about facebook? What about your local bank?
I got a VERO listing removable this week from "lululemon" for using one of their stock photos. If you search Lululemon there is almost 200k results and maybe 20k are stock photos.
Had a listing removed last month because community members reported it as a ⊗⊗⊗⊗...it's not a ⊗⊗⊗⊗.
Year ago I had a watch listing VERO removed for putting "NATO" in the title, if you google "NATO watch strap", it's a type of watch strap. Apparently some sex offender (this is actually true, he's a sex offender) trademarked the word "NATO" and sits on his computer and calls up eBay to remove titles with Nato.
Had a account years ago, first 3 sales were expensive luxury items $500 each, all real, all delivered, positive feedback left, eBay banned for no reason "you pose too much of a risk to our community".

I don't want to sound like an guy in jail claiming he is innocent, but the fact is eBay bans most of the time for no or little reason. If it's obvious someone is a scammer, sure, ban them for life. The fact is they put everyone into the "banned for life" category even when most don't do anything wrong, it's just ebay doesn't like you, or pose too much of a risk to the community, you're gone.

If my bank closes my account, I can walk across the street and open a new bank account.
If my credit card closed my card for missing payments, sure it'll hurt my credit score, but I can open another card from another company.


I don't mind if there is minor problem, they ban for 30 days or 90 days, even 180 days. But when Ebay bans you (even if the reason is just "suspicion"), they save all your personal info and ban any future account for life.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

yeah eBay is gay dude.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Same here. Sold few luxury watches in 2 years, all perfect, all positive feedback, zero issues, everyone is happy, turnover more than 20k eur. Then, some dude purchased 700 eur item from me - instant ban without any explanations besides generic "risk to ebay community". That is very sad. They want is to be long-term legit sellers, but there is no way to do it. Especially with their zero tolerance system, when there are landmines everywhere, like "private auctions", "blurry pictures", "not enough pictures", "not clear description", "Ņeg feedback from some idiot" etc. And all these cause permlimit instead of some friendly talk and attempt to get things right. As they do not put these niances anywhere, but when they evaluate - they use ANY of these to kick you out. And that is horrible way of doing business. Especially when they have all your personal details but behave worse than a bank that just does not have a lawful power to close your account without a warning and seize your money, like ebay does sometimes on MP accs. They are wannabe Amazon now, but the implementation really sucks. How can one create a long serious business with them - not clear.... when your source of funds for living is based on an opinion of some monkey... that is disaster!

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Totally agree Muzzie

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

this is continuation of the same strategy where the philipino reps on the phone decide within a minute who can sell. This is not about stealth but about suspensions at will where legitimate sellers can be suspended without any checks and shady sellers will be let through depending on who makes the decisions and what mood they are in

now with the implementation of managed payments the same thing will be running there as well

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Continued testing currently exposes this:

1) .Co.Uk site now kicks out almost anyone who is not from UK
2) .Com seems to me much more relaxed and welcomes everyone. But their fees are horrid.
3) .Co.Uk. has a chance of surviving if real docs used, and Direct Debit - capable bank is used, with a matching name.
4) .co.uk registered accounts that list on .com also seem to work.

Very foggy it all is, but this is what i've come up to as for now.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

You’ve hit the nail on the head there mate so pretty much stealth is dead and if you’ve managed to pass MP with stealth using docs then sooner or later your going to get pulled up and funds on hold and if the can’t verify you then you’ll have an altogether different issue of getting your funds back.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

Stealth seems possible on .com. not sure about for how long but possible

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

This is closer to my experience. It is not about which site the account was opened on but where you list. .com is more tolerant towards international sellers than UK or Germany. But in general this tolerance applies to the type of items you sell , I think identity checks are done everywhere and additionally some types of bank accounts were blocked. With bank accounts as far as I can say they blocked those who easily take in international customers and assign lots of virtual bank accounts

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

.com listing, shoggy docs, and MM Wise bank - works
.co.uk listing and MM Wise - ban
.co.uk listing and name matching low profile unpopular EMI without direct debit - ban
.co.uk APPLICATION ONLY or MP with creative docs and matching bank - 50% chance of silent kill

So biggest issue as it seems is the local ebay sites. Com seems the best option so far. I guess they want to enforce people to use local sites where possible. Might be some Ayden requirement.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

I do not quite understand though , were all these MP bans or other kinds of bans? and what EMI is meant?

did you have different MP registration countries with all these attempts or was it all for Latvia?

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

MP bans of course, as same items listed on NonMP accs are fine. EMI is one small France company.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

All this talk about SS number, but ETSY and amazon has been this way for years and Come January 1st, all platforms will require it anyways. It will be normal moving forward.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

At least Etsy does not throw you out during registration without any reason. At least in countries outside US.

Re: How I got out of Managed Payments for 2 years...and why I think PayPal will be ba
 

did you have different MP registration countries or were all attempts for Latvia only?