Forum

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

I just changed my residence to NH.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

So how do you fund your Utopia if it isn't stealing from people who produce more? Please explain how you elevate the poor and lazy without theft.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

How does a government fund any services at all if it isn't "stealing from people."

Do you consider the taxes that you currently pay theft?

The current US system is a hybrid of capitalism and socialism that lies somewhere in the middle. The government imposes taxes on its citizens based on their income (as well as taxes on other things, such as property, purchases, etc.) in return for services, such as a military, roads, education, regulatory bodies... the list goes on.

What progressive candidates are calling for is not implementing true socialism, but rather providing expanded services to more people. Some of this may be funded by increased taxes, though not necessarily directly on income, though there is a lot of wasteful spending and cuts to currently funded programs that could also be reallocated to social improvement services.

I think that some also consider social improvement programs to be "Socialism," but fail to consider that other programs are "Socialist" as well. The military and the police are both funded by taxes collected by the government. I don't see anyone complaining that "They are taking my money to pay for soldiers to protect lazy people!"

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Income tax is theft along with most other taxes.

Sell me a service, dont steal and take my money.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

If you don't like it, move to a place where a government doesn't tax you to provide services....

Oh wait....

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

I have and always will operate in tax friendly places.

And how about vote and proactively help change it? That makes the most sense No? You do realize that unlike socialists, conservatives and capitalists dont have to shove that garbage down ones throat. Thanks God we have the ability to change the direction of our surroundings and not be victim to bull****. At least to a certain degree anyways.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

So in a "pay for service" system, how would you go about educating children?

Kids start school at around 5 years old. I wouldn't think that you are advocating that the child be responsible for having raised funding for his education by that age, are you?

So then the responsibility of paying for the 'service' of education would fall to the child's parents, right? What if they are ****-ups. Certainly not every child's parents are financially solvent.

It would seem to me that you are advocating that the child not receive an education, because he has no means to pay.

Here's a similar question:

A person is involved in a severe car accident, and is injured and unconscious. When paramedics show up, should they check to see how much cash he has before they take him into the hospital? Should surgeons swipe his credit card before taking him into the operating room?

One more:

You're being held hostage by a madman. The police arrive, but the hostage negotiator bills a rate of $250 per hour. How do you get him your payment so that he will provide service, without angering your captor?

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Nobody is saying eliminate society. Come on now, if you are going to make an argument, use your brain. We are not going to debate stupidity and pretty much that is how I have interpreted everything you just stated. Kudos on creativity but lets keep things realistic.

As for government and taxes, right now for 2016, USA spends 2.5X every dollar it collects in taxes. Inflation and fiat currency pays for things, not tax money.

If you don't understand the above FACT, then educate yourself and comeback to reality.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

oh sorry, jumped on as misread it as 'any socialites here'..........I will leave you peasants to discuss....

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Okay, I get that you're not trying to eliminate society.

The problem I see is that conservatism is trying to make it so that only the rich get high quality services.

The only reason they would provide services to the poor is to keep them providing the service for low cost, and to allow them to scrape by at a level of quality of life that is just above a humanitarian disaster.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

You can always tell who is broke and failed in life because they are eager to spend other peoples money. Via the government.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Lmfao!!!! Best comment in this thread!

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

We must live in different worlds. I grew up in the Communist State of Massachusetts and by far and away, poor, illegal immigrants and all woman get free basic health care including dental for as long as I have been alive.

If you make a little bit of money, those things cost dearly.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Very simple. If you have no children, you don't pay taxes for schools. If your children go to private or home school you don't pay taxes for schools.


Children are not held responsible for the actions in nearly any situation, so this isn't the same situation as telling everyone they deserve "free" college.

They do bill him for the services whether or not he pays them. It's not just given away for "free". Many many businesses take credit. Not really a valid argument.

Again, this is not the same thing at all. Without police, you have a de-facto anarchy. Saying "should taxes pay for police" is a little silly, because without them, it's not socialism OR capitalism. :)

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

If you honestly believe that you can get "high quality" for "free", please, do yourself a favor and seek treatment at a free healthcare clinic. I'm dead serious. Try it out. See the quality of medical care you get. Observe those in waiting room. Monitor the time-----see how long it takes you to get medical care.

"The medical care is free----good luck getting any."

P.S. Guys---I intended this to be light-hearted. Please don't attack each other. There's no reason we can't laugh at this stuff.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

This guy (GOA) is THE debater. Valid discussions are healthy. Arguments are for who's wrong and who's right. Carry on.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Build them walls...quickly :FF:

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

lol let's build the wall! Keep out the negativity and insults!

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Was my posts too serious?!?!? sorry if so lol

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Discussing politics isn't allowed, technically, since Aspkin has been kind enough to let us talk about it, I think it's best we respect him and be polite and courteous to one another. While I largely agree with your views yankee, I still don't think we should insult one another. This is just a fun distraction from daily business. I don't think any of us have enough influence for our opinions to truly matter, so lets keep that in mind. :)

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

I don't follow third world politics :pound:

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Politics really are not forum material. It shows peoples sides that many of us can not help but to pass judgment upon.

We had a post from someone quite respectable the other day that pretty much said older white conservative males are cheaters and are crazy about porn.

Instant judgement passed on my behalf LOL Lost a lot of respect for the person.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

LOL I remember growing up never talk about politics, race, and religion. That's out the door with the internet. But I think the older you get the stronger ones opinions are. So it's an endless argument about which and who is right.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

i guess it depends who your taken money from to pay for these things... if your talken about taken money from these billion dollar corps then thas cool but if your talken about taken it from a small bizness owner maken 200'000 a yr then NOT cool....

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

I guess you don't own any Stocks or get any Dividends. Not Cool.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

haha yes ofcourse those pesky shareholders...:s

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Just out of question how would you have things like the military funded? Space exploration? Storm damage?

What happens when one person doesn't want a military? Who decides what should be paid for as choice and what should be paid for by by everyone universally?

I do have pretty conservative views myself and there are a lot of things I think should be private, but I do accept that I have to pay taxes and those taxes will go towards things I do not always agree with. I ask the above questions just to see how different people would solve pretty hard questions

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Pffft..... USA is bordering on third world

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Well we live in a backwards world with near Zero interest rates. People are buying Bonds for appreciation and Stocks for Yield. It is insanity!!!

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Greenbean, u should take a stroll thru downtown Oakland, CA, it is a third world! I should also take some pics, looks more and more like Detroit!

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Haha, that is why I made the comment! No PetroDollar and the US in a third world country.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Oakland is bad but because it is in California with the weather it is ok. Detroit you have complete areas that are abandoned. Packs of wild dogs roaming around. Some of it will remind you of pictures and descriptions of Chernobyl today. Completely different, I live in the Bay Area my Sis lived in Piedmont. Oakland and Richmond as well have lots of crime but it isn't even as close to as crazy as Detroit. Detroit in many areas is a Third World Country.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

It may not be as bad as Detroit, but it's going in that direction, just look at all the factories shut off, empty stores, if u go on shattuck ave in Berkeley, u see closed stores, I mean that's a Main Street there. Also, did u know the Bank of America building on Montgomery st, Bank of America moved out of the first floor! I mean, that prime real estate, in the most prestigious st in San Francisco is unoccupied for crying out loud! It's not Detroit, but it's going in that direction.

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Maybe I've been taking the wrong tack here...

Of those of you who support conservative policies on this sort of thing:

Would you consider yourself a person who cares about other people?

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

I don't care about anyone who doesn't work with 3 kids with 3 different dads on benefits

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

So you are okay with children suffering because they have irresponsible parents?

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Certainly Oakland is no longer the city I enjoyed years ago.

Changes are not for the better there... Sadly it is not restricted to just Oakland.


I replied to James' post about the Military.

Luckily my connection timed out as I was not genteel.

I have a close friend who did several tours in Afghanistan. Has an honourable discharge on medical grounds. He has waited 3 years for orthodontic surgery to complete his "repairs". Some clerk at his local Vet Hospital can not fill the paper work in on his behalf...

But migrant neigbors, not yet US citizens have the most modern of homes & appear to have assistance on tap.

Grave inbalance.


=}

You can be both. Just because a person is conservative it doesn't mean that they are totally against all forms of social welfare. Some social welfare is needed IMO in every country. It's people who abuse the system and choose to rely solely on the welfare system instead of working for themselves that I personally dislike.

Even the most successful people can fall on hard times, that is just life, having a social welfare to help those people while they get back on their feet and then start becoming productive again is exactly what it's meant to do. The problem is in many countries people just rely on the social welfare without any ambition to do more with their lives

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

They wouldn't of had them if they didn't know the amount of money they'd be getting

Re: Calling all socialists!
 

Sure... that's the thought going through my mind when me and the lady are about to get it on...