Stealth Expert advice needed: Theory on possible work-around, paypal SSN request

[corleone]

I've done a search, haven't found anything on this, so let me know what you think.

I got a little careless last week and on Dec 30, I sold my 180th item in one of my accounts. I completely forgot about the 200 items sold and was only thinking about the 20,000 limit.

So I understand that once paypal request the SSN, that account is toast, eventually it's going to be fully limited.

Now we'd all love to keep our powerseller accounts active if possible. What do you think about this?

Keeping the old paypal account active with money in it to pay the ebay fees and keeping it linked with ebay.

While. . .

Starting a new paypal account and using that as the payment method in your sold items.

Would this raise red flags? I'm thinking since the paypal account is not shut down completely, maybe it will not send up any alerts and I can continue on with this account.

I have no problem abondoning the account. I have 60 stealth ebay accounts. But this account is 2 years old, has sold high risk items and gotten by without fail(I have some good selling strategies, thanks to this site), it is power seller status, lots of feedback, and I tend to get good end prices on this user.

I'm currently testing the theory in a couple new accounts. Yesterday I think I got a manual review from paypal. They limited 4 paypal accounts, but the ebay accounts are ok for now.

I've switched the listings in the ebay accounts so that payment goes to a new email on an old paypal account. I'm using old paypal accounts that are in good standings, but had the ebay accounts restricted(added new emails to them and using those emails for the payments).

Basically I'm wondering if ebay only looks at the account where automatic payments are made, or if they dig into the accepted payment account as well. I'm sure the bots are pretty thorough, so I won't be surprised if it gets shut down, but basically, I've got nothing to lose as the accounts are dead anyways.

I'm kind of testing the water.

[JJGold]

Originally Posted by corleone

....................
So I understand that once paypal request the SSN, that account is toast, eventually it's going to be fully limited......................

I've heard (read) this mentioned in 3 different threads in as many days and it's pure speculation with no relevant facts to back it up.

[corleone]

Originally Posted by JJGold

I've heard (read) this mentioned in 3 different threads in as many days and it's pure speculation with no relevant facts to back it up.

In all honesty, 90% of the stuff here is speculation. At one time or another over the last 4 years I've done things that the vets here would tell you never to do. . .and many of those accounts are still active to this day.

I think it's all advice based on lowering the risk. I think if you get put under a manual review (which happened to me last night when I lost 4 accounts in the matter of 55 minutes), then the less risks you took the better.

LOL. . . I was sweatin bullets for an hour, watching accounts get flushed down the toilet every 20 minutes. I was just dreading the thought that they would find my 50 other paypal accounts and I'd be back to square one.

Now, my thought is lowering the risk more, by adding a new paypal account to accept the payments on ebay accounts in good standing(but paypal account limited).

I have the feeling that the good ebay accounts with limited paypal's, will still eventually get suspended. Really, all I was trying to do was experiment.

I have a dozen paypal accounts in good standings linked to bad ebays, and I have 4 ebay accounts in good standings with limited paypal accounts.

I wanted to see what would happen if I added new email's to the good paypals and used them on a couple of the good ebays I have with limited paypals. If I can get a couple weeks out of it, then it was worth it as these accounts were in the graveyard anyway.

Now with my powerseller account with SSN limit, I would really like to keep the account. That is the main purpose of my experiment. I have the feeling SSN requirements will be getting stricter and stricter and there needs to be a workaround.

[Roscoe]

90% is speculation from members who are clueless.

There are some of US who spend hours on a daily basis reading threads on this forum, sending PMs, and Testing what works and what doesn't work.

I have no problems with my Stealth PP because I've read the stealth guide about 6x, read thousands of threads, and follow older, more experienced members.

Don't link anything...
Don't use VPNs...
Don't use your real name or names of family/friends...

Don't be stupid!

Stick to the fundamentals and Stealth Works.

Originally Posted by corleone

In all honesty, 90% of the stuff here is speculation. At one time or another over the last 4 years I've done things that the vets here would tell you never to do. . .and many of those accounts are still active to this day.

I think it's all advice based on lowering the risk. I think if you get put under a manual review (which happened to me last night when I lost 4 accounts in the matter of 55 minutes), then the less risks you took the better.

LOL. . . I was sweatin bullets for an hour, watching accounts get flushed down the toilet every 20 minutes. I was just dreading the thought that they would find my 50 other paypal accounts and I'd be back to square one.

Now, my thought is lowering the risk more, by adding a new paypal account to accept the payments on ebay accounts in good standing(but paypal account limited).

I have the feeling that the good ebay accounts with limited paypal's, will still eventually get suspended. Really, all I was trying to do was experiment.

I have a dozen paypal accounts in good standings linked to bad ebays, and I have 4 ebay accounts in good standings with limited paypal accounts.

I wanted to see what would happen if I added new email's to the good paypals and used them on a couple of the good ebays I have with limited paypals. If I can get a couple weeks out of it, then it was worth it as these accounts were in the graveyard anyway.

Now with my powerseller account with SSN limit, I would really like to keep the account. That is the main purpose of my experiment. I have the feeling SSN requirements will be getting stricter and stricter and there needs to be a workaround.

[Sandy D]

Originally Posted by corleone

In all honesty, 90% of the stuff here is speculation. At one time or another over the last 4 years I've done things that the vets here would tell you never to do. . .and many of those accounts are still active to this day.

Things change daily and what works for you might not work for someone else.

And I have taken advice from many vets here that worked like a charm. Far more then it never worked.

You failed to mention just how much FREE advise you have taken from the vets and they worked. You had to learn somewhere and I am probably sure it was right here.


I think it's all advice based on lowering the risk. I think if you get put under a manual review (which happened to me last night when I lost 4 accounts in the matter of 55 minutes), then the less risks you took the better.

If you lost 4 accounts in 55 minutes then you must not have listened to one of the vets who have not lost accounts in more then 2 years!!!

LOL. . . I was sweatin bullets for an hour, watching accounts get flushed down the toilet every 20 minutes. I was just dreading the thought that they would find my 50 other paypal accounts and I'd be back to square one.

Now, my thought is lowering the risk more, by adding a new paypal account to accept the payments on ebay accounts in good standing(but paypal account limited).

I have the feeling that the good ebay accounts with limited paypal's, will still eventually get suspended. Really, all I was trying to do was experiment.

I have a dozen paypal accounts in good standings linked to bad ebays, and I have 4 ebay accounts in good standings with limited paypal accounts.

I wanted to see what would happen if I added new email's to the good paypals and used them on a couple of the good ebays I have with limited paypals. If I can get a couple weeks out of it, then it was worth it as these accounts were in the graveyard anyway.

Now with my powerseller account with SSN limit, I would really like to keep the account. That is the main purpose of my experiment. I have the feeling SSN requirements will be getting stricter and stricter and there needs to be a workaround.

If there ever is a workaround most likely one of our vets will figure it out.

I cannot believe you slammed the vets here knowing they have not only helped you and I but thousands of other people who seemed to be doomed without some of these vets sharing their time and info.

I will wait to see the long laundry list of things OUR VETS showed you how to do so you can give them some credit instead of slamming them.

For me, the vets here took me under their wings from day one and believe me I have not lost any account in years, have close to 500 accounts that are working and have made tons of money doing the things these vets and new people have posted.

I give all my success credit to listening to those same vets you just slammed and of course some of my own testing and using some common sense after learning the ropes from those people.

Thanks to the vets and other here who have posted their knowledge or none of us would be successful today.




** Funny you are asking for a stealth expert to help you.

[corleone]

Originally Posted by Sandy D

If there ever is a workaround most likely one of our vets will figure it out.

I cannot believe you slammed the vets here knowing they have not only helped you and I but thousands of other people who seemed to be doomed without some of these vets sharing their time and info.

I will wait to see the long laundry list of things OUR VETS showed you how to do so you can give them some credit instead of slamming them.

For me, the vets here took me under their wings from day one and believe me I have not lost any account in years, have close to 500 accounts that are working and have made tons of money doing the things these vets and new people have posted.

I give all my success credit to listening to those same vets you just slammed and of course some of my own testing and using some common sense after learning the ropes from those people.

Thanks to the vets and other here who have posted their knowledge or none of us would be successful today.




** Funny you are asking for a stealth expert to help you.

Easy there turbo. I wasn't putting down anyone, nor was I putting down the site. I think that sentence was interpreted wrong.

Speculation does not mean that their info is wrong. I can't tell you for a fact that it's cold right now in Alaska, but I can speculate that it is.

I've had many conversations with aspkin and Greenbean through PM. They take the time to answer questions and are alway's polite and willing to share. Please show me where I slammed them if you are going to accuse me.


I think most of them will even tell you that the idea's here are "THEORY".

There are many theories here which obviously make good sense, and should be one of the commandments to stealth by. . .but there are also a few that I think are very far fetched. Even with that said, I try to use even the most far-fetched precautions because my accounts are too important to me. So even the most outrageious ideas, I try to put into my routine.

As far as I know, nobody here works for paypal or ebay, especially in the fraud department. I've had accounts where I've meticulously done everything to a tee, and I've had accounts where I've absent mindedly logged in under the wrong user account, or forgot to change the IP address, or answered an email though the wrong email account. Strangely, none of the half dozen accounts where I've made mistakes have gone down yet.

I also have quite a bit of accounts, but not as many as you. I have 60 active stealth accounts and move on average 1,000 per month per account. These are high risk items(not illegal, but high risk items that ebay loves to pay close attention to) I am selling, so I have an idea myself on what works and what really doesn't make a difference. I've had about 10 paypal accounts limited in the last 2 years. If you want to discuss the amount of money I've brought in over that time, with the amount of accounts lost, I don't think I've done too bad. Let's say I average about $100,000 brought in for every account lost. I'm not a newbie, so let's cool it on the "you must not be doing something right" routine. I spend 12 hours per day on this job, so I must be doing something right.

I did not attack anyone, but yet you felt the need to go out of your way to bold your sentences like I was attacking the site. I think you need to know that I did not say that the info from vets is misguided, I just said it's speculation.

I do not get everything for free. I have purchased the stealth guide to help aspkin. I will be joining the membership board here soon, I'm super swamped with work and don't really even have time to post on a forum. I now have some genuine unique original ideas to add of my own to contribute to the site, does that not count for anything?

[Sandy D]

Sorry my comments were not meant to offend you.

I read it as though the vets were steering you wrong in some cases.

And for me, I will defend out vets here to the end, they have been amazing to me and I give them credit for what I know today.

Even some of our newbies are very bright and have some fantastic ideas.

I apologize if I offended you in any way, I never would personally offend someone and you as being here for 3 years I would have your back as well.

No worries.

Sandy

[corleone]

Originally Posted by Sandy D

Sorry my comments were not meant to offend you.

I read it as though the vets were steering you wrong in some cases.

And for me, I will defend out vets here to the end, they have been amazing to me and I give them credit for what I know today.

Even some of our newbies are very bright and have some fantastic ideas.

I apologize if I offended you in any way, I never would personally offend someone and you as being here for 3 years I would have your back as well.

No worries.

Sandy

I hope to be more active soon. I've wanted to get involved in this board, especially since almost everything I've learned, I've learned here. Within a few months I should have some more time, and I will be joining the subscribing section. I'm sure we'll get to know eachother more.

[mrstealth99]

Well, despite my close monitoring of the situation I got the dreaded email requesting the SS#. The account is still functioning normally, although I am not sure for how long.

It is giving me 2 options, provide a SS# or convert to a business account and provide an EIN number.

TO answer your question, as long as the paypal account is a verified paypal account it will work to accept payments (at least it is for me). Just make sure though that account is not linked in any way to a banned account or the hole thing will collapse on you.

[corleone]

Originally Posted by mrstealth99

Well, despite my close monitoring of the situation I got the dreaded email requesting the SS#. The account is still functioning normally, although I am not sure for how long.

It is giving me 2 options, provide a SS# or convert to a business account and provide an EIN number.

TO answer your question, as long as the paypal account is a verified paypal account it will work to accept payments (at least it is for me). Just make sure though that account is not linked in any way to a banned account or the hole thing will collapse on you.

I realilze it will continue to work. Mine works as well, but I suspect that if we keep using it over the course of the year we will get the dreaded "account limited until we hear from you".

My suggestion is to open a new paypal account. Use the same home address if you like, different name though.

Then use that paypal account to accept the paypal payments in the ebay listings.

Since the paypal account has received the tax user id request, we may want to abandon it. My thought is to keep in on record with ebay for automatic billing, keep some money in it to pay fees and such, but use the other account to start the 20k/200 transaction over.

What I am hoping, is that since the tax id request account is not "fully limited", it may not throw up any red flags to link the new account.

The simple solution is to abandon both ebay and paypal accounts and go with new stealth accounts, but the smart solution may be different. If you've acquired 20k in a year, there's a good chance these accounts are powerseller/top rated sellers. We want to try and keep these accounts as long as possible.

[Futuremogul888]

There is any easy work around that has been talked about many times on this forum. Follow these steps:

1)Incorporate (LLC, Corp, etc) and get EIN
2)Upgrade to business Paypal account (and not required but a good idea: upgrade Ebay account to business)
3) Provide business Info and EIN

Requirement met

Alternative make many stealth accounts, spread your sales across them, and you will never come even close to the 200/20,000 limit.

[GreenBean]

Originally Posted by Futuremogul888

Alternative make many stealth accounts, spread your sales across them, and you will never come even close to the 200/20,000 limit.

Users have to bear in mind that taxes are still to be paid.

Earn money regardless of the accounts that get made, taxes are payable.

Multiple stealth accounts are NOT a panacea for tax avoidance.

Avoid inferring otherwise.

[slapped]

Originally Posted by Futuremogul888

There is any easy work around that has been talked about many times on this forum. Follow these steps:

1)Incorporate (LLC, Corp, etc) and get EIN
2)Upgrade to business Paypal account (and not required but a good idea: upgrade Ebay account to business)
3) Provide business Info and EIN

Requirement met

Alternative make many stealth accounts, spread your sales across them, and you will never come even close to the 200/20,000 limit.

I ABSOLUTLY second this, There is NO Better way to deal with the SSN Issue, there may come a time where Paypal will not give you that option, but it is Rare that they will ask for a SSN once they have an EIN on file, althought it does happen from time time,,,also there will NO longer be a need to worry about 20/200

As for your theory, It will work, I Know I used to do that years ago, Before I got onto the EIN Bandwagon,,so to me its Nothing new, However It will NOT work for any great length of time, ALL Three accounts,, the Ebay and the 2 Paypal accounts will eventaully go down, its only a matter of time

[veggiegymrat]

Even if you provide SS/EIN, they only send the 1099 if it exceeds both 200/20K, correct? As long as it stays below, even though they have your SS, the law is that you're not 1099'ed until you exceed. Can anyone verify?

[zoneout]

Originally Posted by veggiegymrat

Even if you provide SS/EIN, they only send the 1099 if it exceeds both 200/20K, correct? As long as it stays below, even though they have your SS, the law is that you're not 1099'ed until you exceed. Can anyone verify?

That is correct.

[GreenBean]

Originally Posted by zoneout

That is correct.

On what grounds is this correct?

I ask because users have had got the 1099 for amounts under $10,000.

Could you explain that?

[zoneout]

Originally Posted by GreenBean™

On what grounds is this correct?

I ask because users have had got the 1099 for amounts under $10,000.

Could you explain that?

As per IRS instructions......

Beginning in January, 2012, payment settlement entities (PSEs) are required by the Housing Assistance Tax Act of 2008 to report on Form 1099-K the following transactions:
All payments made in settlement of payment card transactions (e.g., credit card);
Payments in settlement of third party network transactions IF:
-Gross payments to a participating payee exceed $20,000; AND
-There are more than 200 transactions with the participating payee.

[zoneout]

Originally Posted by GreenBean™

On what grounds is this correct?

I ask because users have had got the 1099 for amounts under $10,000.

Could you explain that?

Without knowing the details of the cases you mention one can only speculate that they have multiple accounts with a PSE and the gross for all the accounts exceeds the limit though each acct is 1099`d individually.

[Roscoe]

Originally Posted by GreenBean™

On what grounds is this correct?

I ask because users have had got the 1099 for amounts under $10,000.
Could you explain that?

I think I hold the record for the least amount of sales to receive the dreaded Soc Sec request.

4 sales recurring MONTHLY at $247.000 or $1,000.00 per month.

I contacted PP and they told me they Annualized the sales ($12,000) and they assumed I would be signing up more subscribers.

I now do monthly sales Manually to avoid this.

[JJGold]

Originally Posted by GreenBean™

On what grounds is this correct?

I ask because users have had got the 1099 for amounts under $10,000.

Could you explain that?

GB, are you saying they got the 1099 or they got the 1099 email requesting a SS# or EIN? Typically IRS form 1099 is sent out only once per year no later then January 31st for the previous tax year.

[slapped]

If you are issued a 1099K by Paypal, Amazon or whomever, you MUST include those figures in your returns, NOT doing so is the DUMBEST thing that anyone could ever do.

You can play whatever game you want with the likes of Paypal, Amazon, Ebay or whoever, but you CANNOT play with Uncle Sam. The IRS has more collection Power than ANY authority on the PLANET, they will hook you up to an IV and get their money in blood if they have to,,,Remember its Goverment law that protects you form Companies trying to collect money from you,,,It seems like NONE of those laws applies to the IRS,,

another thing,,,Remember that all those EIN's are tied to you Personally, so if you have 5 1099K's each for about $5000.00 from 5 Different EIN's, then YOUR SSN has at least $25,000 in Income, So Report it to the IRS and PAY your Taxes,,BELIEVE Me ANYTHING else will be VERY Painful, and NOT an option,,,

[Mr. Invisible]

I miss reported 60K in Forex/Futures trading income (my main income source) from 1997. It was a COMPLETE NIGHTMARE!

PAY YOUR TAXES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Do they still request SSN if you convert to business using a DBA?