US Election 2016

GreenBean · #**375** 05-12-2016

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesNorth101

I have only spoken to 5/6 mind you about it so they may well not reflect the overall mood of the country

Those that did not have, need or use firearms went along like sheep to the slaughter.

Those whose life involved firearms are still fighting today.

The US people must ensure their rights to bear firearms are NOT taken away.

GhostOfAmazon · #**376** 05-12-2016

The problem with outlawing firearms is that when you do it, only criminals own them.

Think about it. Say you implement a 5 year prison sentence for owning a gun. Great, except for the guy planning on using it illegally, to say, rob a liquor store, he's going to get at least 10-20 if caught, so whoop de doo! What these laws do is tell every criminal that they can pull a gun with CERTAINTY that they will not be oppsed with equal force.

The guns are ALREADY here in America. It's not even as though they have to go through a bunch of black market crap to get them. Outlawing them would just get rid of the law abiding citizens guns. The fact is, even pacifists benefit from having the ability to get guns, because no criminal wants to break into a house that may have someone with a shotgun in it. Unless you advertise that you don't own a gun, just that subconscious though (what if they have a gun?) deters a LOT of crime.

If you have any doubt, take a look at Chicago as an example....

GreenBean · #**377** 05-12-2016

People tried to present that pov, GOA, in Australia.

No luck at all.

GhostOfAmazon · #**378** 05-12-2016

If the American people are stupid enough to vote in a woman who has promised to abolish the rights promised by the Constitution, well, they deserve what's coming to them.

As for me, I'll ship my product to FBA and move somewhere else.

GreenBean · #**379** 05-13-2016

Belize is not too far away to be considered.

oompaloompa · #**380** 05-13-2016

how many mistakes or accidents happen with firearms, eg. kids firing them....how likely are you do die by accident or in a crossfire than a genuine intruder/self-defense incident? I do not know, but it seems you have alot of gun deaths that would not happen if the guns were outlawed....

the thing about only criminals having them is partially true I think, it is like that in UK, but because guns are not a part of life here, criminals do not routinely own them, they are harder to get hold of, and most common criminals would not have one....it is only hardcore ones. Bottom line is far less gun dealths per capita, figures speak for themselves.

thing is in US, you have a stash of guns that would not be handed in, so I suppose it is true, law abiders would be gunless vs crimininals...it would need a massive crackdown indepth......it would be worth it in the long run though..

my fear would be everyday life in the US, you get in to a road rage incident in UK, you know they do not have a gun in their bag, and if they are having a bad day, I would be scared of upsetting anyone......if I am a teacher that has to tell off a strange-minded pupil in UK, it does not enter my head that they could come back armed....

gun lobby people are insular and should live abroad for a wider perspective...

GreenBean · #**381** 05-13-2016

Been proven outlawing firearms does not stop issues.

JamesNorth101 · #**382** 05-13-2016

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostOfAmazon

The problem with outlawing firearms is that when you do it, only criminals own them.

Think about it. Say you implement a 5 year prison sentence for owning a gun. Great, except for the guy planning on using it illegally, to say, rob a liquor store, he's going to get at least 10-20 if caught, so whoop de doo! What these laws do is tell every criminal that they can pull a gun with CERTAINTY that they will not be oppsed with equal force.

The guns are ALREADY here in America. It's not even as though they have to go through a bunch of black market crap to get them. Outlawing them would just get rid of the law abiding citizens guns. The fact is, even pacifists benefit from having the ability to get guns, because no criminal wants to break into a house that may have someone with a shotgun in it. Unless you advertise that you don't own a gun, just that subconscious though (what if they have a gun?) deters a LOT of crime.

If you have any doubt, take a look at Chicago as an example....

Yes in the US that would be exactly the issue. There are just so many guns about that trying to remove them would be a total waste of effect and you would end up just making criminals of a lot of people who don't want to use the guns for illegal activities but also will just not give up their guns.

In the UK not very many gun crimes occur because they are much less readily available. Comparing the 2 is like apples to car types. Worlds apart.

I just find the entire thing pretty interesting how in the US guns make people feel very safe. I have always looked at it from the point of view that I feel really safe not having guns and knowing that no one else has guns. Neither is the right POV just different prospectives on the same issue.

GhostOfAmazon · #**383** 05-13-2016

We were also founded off the principle of defending ourselves against a overreaching government (which, ironically, was England at the time).

The reason we have the right to bear arms is so the government stays in check, ironic they are the ones pushing to outlaw them....

JamesNorth101 · #**384** 05-13-2016

Realistically the people of the US are not exactly going to storm the the White House if they feel that the government is starting to overreach.

The primary reason for everyone being allowed guns originally was so if the red coats came back militia could easily be mobilized back in the day

GreenBean · #**385** 05-13-2016

There is nothing wrong with allowing this long standing Constitutional right to continue.

I

yankee · #**386** 05-13-2016

That is quite arguable both ways James.

Some statistics show that American Households have more guns than all other countries militia combined. It averages 7 per household according to the same studies.

Now these studies are quite biased so who knows for sure.

I am not much of a gun guy myself. I shot my first firearm this past february on a night time hog hunt in Georgia where archery tackle just was not suitable for removing nuisance hogs.

With that being said the idea that my government both state and Federal want to remove my civil rights and confiscate my property pissed me off to the point I changed my domicile to a quite free state and have now also applied for my Utah carry permit as well.

I resided in a state that has 101 more gun laws than any other and where you need a permit to buy powder, never mind a shotgun or shell. To get a permit to own or purchase the most simplest of firearms required a gun course(hundreds of dollars), hunters education course, 2000 word essay, two meetings with the chief of police, a $400 bi-annual fee and several months. The most unconstitutional state in the Nation. Also happens to be the only state that has a natural depopulation. Coincidence? I doubt it...

So I absolutely own plenty of guns purchased in the past few months all from the shear principle that the government wants to take them away from law abiding citizens. It also happened at a time in my outdoors career to broaden my horizons a bit.

If you look at the largest gun grabs across the world in modern history, all seem to be from socialists and communist headed countries with the exceptions of Canada and Australia.

yankee · #**387** 05-13-2016

That is saying that you don't already consider either of those countries edging socialist already, especially Canada being the largest employer is the Government and exceedingly high provisional/Federal taxes to cover wages and healthcare.

dan_ebay · #**388** 05-13-2016

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostOfAmazon

The problem with outlawing firearms is that when you do it, only criminals own them.

Think about it. Say you implement a 5 year prison sentence for owning a gun. Great, except for the guy planning on using it illegally, to say, rob a liquor store, he's going to get at least 10-20 if caught, so whoop de doo! What these laws do is tell every criminal that they can pull a gun with CERTAINTY that they will not be oppsed with equal force.

The guns are ALREADY here in America. It's not even as though they have to go through a bunch of black market crap to get them. Outlawing them would just get rid of the law abiding citizens guns. The fact is, even pacifists benefit from having the ability to get guns, because no criminal wants to break into a house that may have someone with a shotgun in it. Unless you advertise that you don't own a gun, just that subconscious though (what if they have a gun?) deters a LOT of crime.

If you have any doubt, take a look at Chicago as an example....

I doubt theres more than 5 cases a year of someone breaking into someones house with a gun in the UK. Are there less than that in the US then?

legal guns+no help for mental health=boom.

And heres the stats for after Australias gun law reforms, looks quite conclusive:
Australiaâ€™s 1996 gun law reforms: faster falls in firearm deaths, firearm suicides, and a decade without mass shootings -- Chapman et al. 12 (6): 365 -- Injury Prevention

bjammin · #**389** 05-13-2016

I have never owned a gun nor fired a gun. But I will say that govt telling me that I cannot own a gun would piss me off. I feel that one day I may decide that I want a gun or need a gun to protect my property or family. I might decide I want one in case the zombie apocalypse breaks out. Who knows. But whether I exercise this freedom or not, it is not one that I want taken away.

MM78 · #**390** 05-13-2016

MM78 · #**391** 05-13-2016

GhostOfAmazon · #**392** 05-13-2016

Many US Citizens, even conservatives, do agree that we need to cut our military spending.

Even Donald Trump, whom you are obviously against, has said we should either charge allies for our protection (thus eliminating the cost of foreign bases) or pull out of some of these countries.

GreenBean · #**393** 05-13-2016

I can not help but notice there are some biased snide comments running through this thread.

We got given the chance to "chat" on the election.

We were not given the chance to infer a lack of equality or goodness of US citizens.

**aspkin** · #**394** 05-15-2016

The Trump train just keeps on rolling..

JamesNorth101 · #**395** 05-15-2016

I think this is the first thread I have seen to get just 1 star!

**TGMT²** · #**396** 05-15-2016

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesNorth101

I think this is the first thread I have seen to get just 1 star!

It happens to be my favorite "Everything Else" thread.

I'm going to vote and move that star up to 3.