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Re: US Election 2016
 

Agree - should focus more on internal problems.

Re: US Election 2016
 

If Murica would stop funding world wars and cut its military budget right the way down you would have a country that could provide free healthcare AND education to the whole nation.
They could also subsidize nationwide healthcare program, and not big oil, pharma and corn.

America is not about politics and all that life.
America is just a big corporation who elects a new President for the company every 4 years, but decisions will be taken by majority of the board... But the public doesn't really know who the board members are.

Each active President AND candidates who are running for president should have NASCAR style suits on- You can then see who has taken money from who and size of a badge determines how much each corporation has paid for that advertisement slot.

Its all a big ****show and I can not wait to see it all collapse. Sure, world will be in turmoil and economy will crash and people will suffer. Sure. But it's just a reality TV show that we are currently watching- I mean... Surely you can't keep this up forever?

Re: US Election 2016
 

I agree 100% with everything you just said....except the last part. I don't want the country to collapse.

Re: US Election 2016
 

You would think they can't Haidukken!, but there is nothing to stop them doing just that, us as well, the U of K doesn't get away Scot free by any means. America is the self proclaimed leader of the free world and much bigger, that is the only difference really between them and us.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Maybe the country has to go to a low point before it can become potent again?

:peace:

Re: US Election 2016
 

Sadly enough, this has been my theory since Obama was re-elected. :doh:

The American people were stupid enough to re-elect two horrible presidents in a row.

Re: US Election 2016
 

If it was UK who was on the edge of a financial collapse, I wouldn't want it to happen either- All zombie jokes aside, can you imagine what a real collapse would bring with it? I wouldn't want to be anywhere near it!

BUT, it usually take a catastrophic event before people see different ways to solve the same puzzle.
9/11 would be a good example, because it happened in USA- I remember watching it on TV as it happened when I was a kid and it was just so alien to me, because it happened way, waaaaay away from me and my home. It affected America differently tho, didn't it... I can't remember the last time America was so united and together, everybody had a really healthy dose of reality check and people suddenly cared for each other.
It's very unfortunate that this unity was used to start a war, but thats besides the point.

From an outside it just seems that America is so used to the way that they operate, that they think it's the only way to operate. It's very narrow minded and very "tunnel vision" esque.
People have stopped questioning the fundamentals of life, of the society that they live in.

In smaller EU countries changes are easy to come by, because most of the countries have history of different rulers- Most smaller countries had a different military power occupying them every 30-50 years! So now when they want to change something, people vote for it and not against it- People are used to the idea of things changing and they actively try to make changes happen themselves, because they just appreciate the fact that they have the freedom to do so, nothing more and nothing less.

As I mentioned before, America has been a reality TV/science project of mine for many years now. It's truly remarkable how one of the youngest nations in the world has grown a pair of balls so big that it takes on the historical superpowers like Russia and China.

American people just need to realise that their biggest resource as a nation is... Well, the people themselves.

Re: US Election 2016
 

You're wise beyond your years. If only 20% of Americans thought like you, turning the country around would be a good possibility.

The sheeple are manipulated by the media so easily. They believe anything and everything these corporations tell them. Iraq is bad! Let's go kill them! Turns out, Saddam Hussein, though a good guy he was not, did have a pretty good thumb over terrorists (he killed them) and did not have any nuclear weapons. But Bush, like his daddy, was into Oil, and guess where most of that comes from? Also, as you said before, war is our biggest industry. Tanks, guns, bombs....very expensive, and very profitable to make. Put it all together and you have the perfect reason to go to war.

So on the one hand, you have the war-mongering people who hate whoever they are told is bad, and on the other, you have the idiots who think that there are no consequences to Americas actions, and that every other country and group of people love us and would never want to kill Americans.

Then, somewhere in the middle, are the rational people like myself who just want to leave everyone else alone and focus on our OWN problems. Forget the welfare state, forget going to war, forget being the world police: Let's clean out our own closet, prosecute career criminal politicians, end the corruption, stop importing what is essentially slave labor from the 3rd world, and fix our broken country.

Re: US Election 2016
 

People from outside of the USA need to understand that the country had centuries long policy of Isolationism.

Changes where made, did not come easily to the Nation.

=}

Re: US Election 2016
 

What I find crazy is all the outsiders who complain about the USA but yet line up at the door or literally just walk in. If the place sucks so bad why the heck come here? LOL

and everyone from Europe bashing on the USA are calling the kettle black. If I remember history correctly Europe dragged the USA(and by all means we should have stepped up earlier) into being the worlds police....

But much like Ghost, I am all for the SECURE and STRONG yet libertarian stance. Worry about out own issues and screw the rest of ya haha Just joking....Kinda.

Re: US Election 2016
 

There's nothing wrong with helping out when REQUESTED, and when it doesn't interfere with another country. (For example, I really don't think we have any business messing around with non-EU Ukraine....kicking a hornets nest is stupid). But our problem is we stick our noses everywhere, even when we're not needed. It's no wonder the rest of the world laughs at us, hates us, gossips about us. We're that annoying kid in high school who's always trying to sit at a different lunch table everyday and never hangs out with his own friends (because secretly he has none).

Re: US Election 2016
 

The problem with international politics is that non of us actually really know what is going on. The media is fictitious and most likely has no clue either. The USA has really messed with a lot of the middle east for reasons beyond our comprehension in the name of "Security" yet the apparently really dangerous countries we give foreign aid to in the billions and billions of dollars.

I stopped trying to understand the mess when the USA aided the "rebels" in Libia that we just ran out of Iraq for the sake of cheap oil to prevent a France economic collapse or so it seems anyways. Those exact rebels we now call Isis apparently and the country if Libia is not recognizable.

Make sense? I am sure it does to the world puppet pullers but not the rest of the world.

Re: US Election 2016
 

That's because none of it is actually political. It's all about favors for corporations and the people that run them. Globalism is VERY profitable if you own the right corporation. Americans are EXPENSIVE to employ, even on minimum wage, with social security, healthcare, etc. Much cheaper to stage a coup than use the newly "freed" 3rd world population as essentially slave labor.

Also, sometimes these coups have to do with currency manipulation. That's how George Soros (backer of John Kasich, Hillary Clinton, and Bernie Sanders) made his billions.

I'm not making any of this up. Google it yourself. I'm not into conspiracy theories, but I do more research than just watching Fox News and NBC.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Preaching to the Quire on your last bit Ghost. I hear you and agree. NWO has begun a very long time ago.

Re: US Election 2016
 

yo, you have comedy stores and legal weed in Colorado? OFC people want to move in!


America would be truly amazing if they'd take all the military they have around the world and call them back home, close down all the military bases in other countries(I believe you have over 100 of them) and just have a SOLID AS **** defense system in place.
Then have a black president go on TV and say:

"Hey guys, we are sorry that we fiddled with your governments, natural resources and people... We really are, BUT it had to be done- Sorry.
We, as a nation, have decided that... **** ALL y'll and we are gonna just kick back and chill now for 50 years or so.
If you guys want to duke it out, thats fine by us... As long as it doesn't happen on our soil.
Now just to let you know- We have ALL of our military powers concentrated here on our own soil so please don't make us use it"

Can you imagine? America would go from dictatorship police state to a lovely, innovative place for science and free speech. Housing project problems and systemic racism could be tackled, equal right could become equal... The possibilities are literally endless because of the way the government has been set up.
What war and financial crisis have thought us is that US and A can solve problems real quick, if they need to.
Can you imagine if you could turn the same warmongering machine around and instead of printing money for war they would print money for all the good causes?

Jesus, we would have a pill that cures AIDS, cancer AND hangover at the same time!

Re: US Election 2016
 

Actually if you follow history and go back just few generations you can see how it all happened in the first place. I always wonder how is it possible that people remember who Bruce Jenner is, but they can't remember who the **** put Sadam and Bin Laden family in charge in first place.

The Petrodollar thing is as real as it gets and everything that has happened after that is just proof how a nation can, and in many cases SHOULD, do what ever it takes to protect their interest. In Muricas case they have had to deal with few different generations of powerful families and only lately has it been messy. It was quite an easy thing to brush under the rug for many years but now with mass media, internet and tin foil hat wearing fanatics that call themselves patriots things can get out of hand real quick.

First it was a business decision and they just handed out power to families, then they had to bring war into it just to justify political pressure in some areas of the world and now for the past 10 or so years they call it "fighting for freedom" or they just say that they are helping a country to have a democratic government...

Its really, really interesting because the thing that they are fighting over is not something amazing... its just fuel.
Give it 50 years and we will look back at the time of combustion engine and see it as primitive as stone tools and telegraph machines.

Re: US Election 2016
 

ALSO, lets talk about US prison population?

How can anybody justfy having so many people in jail for non-violent drug related crimes? If you dig in some data it clearly shows that black people are being arrested and jailed for YEARS, for the same exact drug that Lohan does and get away with. Whats the deal with that?

Oh, thats right... One is called crack and other one is called cocaine. Clearly two different drugs- One is HORRIBLE and kills people and give you a legit chance of making into top10 meth faces of 2016 ranking and the other drug is for professionals, white people and people of class.

Institutional racism is oh so real, and I ain't even black.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Also, this might be the best thread of 2016... No wonder Bigboss doesn't allow politics to be discussed in this forum. I can clearly see how things could get out of hand, reaaaaal quick.

Re: US Election 2016
 

The reason prisons are so populated has to do with many of them being privatized, not racism.

When you make confining people a for profit BUSINESS, obviously there's incentive to throw people in jail for BS crimes. Also keep in mind that African-Americans are less likely to have the funds for a good lawyer, which plays a large roll. Justices for all (who have stacks of $$$$)

Re: US Election 2016
 

I'd argue that private prisons are a big driving force behind some very, very questionable laws and practices. If the Prison Guards Union can lobby for/against certain laws that directly benefit them then surely the laws will be geared towards a % of population that is least suited to defend themselves.

If you have problem with poor housing projects(black or white) and you have laws that punish people for certain activities and you then "give them justice" for what they have done(non-violent drug offences) then you will have generations upon generations of kids growing up in broken families, in broken housing projects and with no realistic way out.
To me, that seems very systematic process- Almost like a feeding line, a feeding line of people who will one day most likely be charged with a crime. Its the supply and demand, of people.

Many people will still bang the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" drum and expect problems to go away. Very few people actually want to make the situation better.
Its terrifing to think that in 2016 you could not only get a **** roll of a dice and be born in Uganda, but you could get a **** roll of the dice and be born in USA, but into one of the poorest areas where your older brother and dad are already in prison and everybody around you are struggling to find a job, because there are no jobs.

Earlier when I mentioned that less losers=better country, thats what I meant. I don't mean lets take some wealthy loser and show him how to be a good person... Nope, they don't need "that" sort of help.
Take the kids from hoods, white or black, and give them a chance. Invest into the youth of today and spoon feed them until they can see a way out- People think that there is something wrong with helping someone who is already down and out. That for some reason help makes him "soft" and that he'll take advantage of the help and it'll turn the person lazy... BITCH, I'd rather have kids being lazy than smoking crack!

I'd rather have kids be lazy who benefit from support system than have some crazy white fat ******* in government office who benefits from taxpayers money that in financing killing in other countries.

Tho whole thing is so backwards that sometimes it makes me want to cry, honestly. It doesn't affect me directly and I don't know anybody in these situations... But that doesn't mean its not happening all the time, all over the world.
Whats the difference between the little dude you see on TV who has flies in his eyes and hasn't had water for 3 days and the little dude who sits in a closet somewhere in Compton whilst his mom is blowing dudes and smoking crack in front of her?
****ing nothing, they are both equal- They are the future of this planet, but because one of the little dudes lives in USA people suddenly think he should be pulling himself by his bootstraps and go get his American Dream.

Re: US Election 2016
 

So....you're saying MORE welfare is the solution?

Re: US Election 2016
 

I found this meme hilarious and yet insightful...

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...ef&oe=57BB695C

Re: US Election 2016
 

Nobody has argued free college would bankrupt a (already bankrupt) nation..

The F-35 was a terrible waste of money but it was backed by corporate interests and the politicians (Sanders?) in those corporation's pockets. Just like college lobbyists have secured government-backed funding for colleges, lol.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Controlled walfare, thats all.

It's not always cold hard cash that people need, it's so much more than that. Money hardly ever solves problems(based on personal experience)- It's the whole show a man how to catch the fish story.

Also, whats so bad about guaranteed basic income, just for being a person? Like... How long will we have the mentality that "work" as such is part of life? Soon enough we will have a situation where AI/Robots/Advanced technology/Call it whatever will be able to look after our basic needs: energy, food/water supply and where we live.
What will happen then? I mean, if we don't have to work to keep the machine going for the first time in history surely it'll bring some changes to the way we view life.

OR, do we really think that our mission in life is to work? HEH, majority of the people work because they have to. If you can eliminate the NEED and replace it by interest then people would have more time to come up with cool **** to improve our lives, planet and so on.

At the moment, majority of the people are stuck in a ****bracket of life, chasing some weird dreams that they see other people chase on TV and think its the best life to live.


PS: UK is a perfect example how benefits/welfare should NOT be done. Jesus **** its bad over here. Basic benefits are more than minimum wage, so why even work?

Re: US Election 2016
 

Everything that is wrong with America!
This is exactly why half our country laughs at yours and thinks it is doing very poorly because in our eyes, it is three dacades ahead of us in the wrong direction.

Americans all in all do not want to be the UK. It is exactly what we DON'T WANT. Americans as a whole DO NOT WANT TO BE SOCIALISTS. Only our career welfare recipients and people benefiting from them do. The exact people you have been bashing.

Re: US Election 2016
 

The UK is not a socialist country...

We do have an unbalance welfare system though, although its a LOT LOT better than it was 6/7 years ago

I think of myself as conservative and I have a lot of friends that are as well, none of us would want to be rid of the NHS. The continued overall of the welfare system we have in the UK yes, but not the NHS

It used to be in the UK that a family from Romania could move over here, be given a £1m house in London to live in rent free and then £80k a year to live on (although that is an extreme sample it did happen). Thankfully that is in the past now and we are moving in the right direction in which is pays to work

Re: US Election 2016
 

I just want to point something out, I REFUSE to get drawn into the liberal vs conservative nonsense, so don't even try...

There is a REASON that some nations have decided to make college free. That reason has nothing to do with "free stuff". And it does not mean that ALL colleges are free, just the public ones.

The fact is, the more educated the people are, the better off the country as a whole is. The more opportunities there are for everyone and the country AS A WHOLE.

These nations do not do it so they can give "free stuff" to people who are lazy or anything like that. If implemented here, not ALL colleges would be free. Harvard, Stanford, Yale, the University of Chicago - the top tier schools would still cost a fortune. So would the private colleges. Only the public ones would be free.

The other thing that is happening in these other countries is that not everyone who gets free college is taking four years of it. Many of these colleges offer programs that provide basic training for jobs that are in demand. The more the country needs plumbers, the more slots there will be in that training program. That way, they can steer students into careers where jobs are actually available and society as a whole benefits. Have a shortage of nurses? Increase the number of slots. Too many nurses? Decrease the number of slots.

This is what I meant about people in the US needing civics classes. I see a lot of people using talking points about "free stuff" and other nonsense with no thought as to what the proposed program would actually accomplish. Mr Sanders and I would not agree on a lot of things, but this is one area where I would support him 100%.

It is about investing in society as a whole, not about welfare, or giving people something for nothing that they do not deserve. Yes, individuals DO benefit from it. But the benefits to the country as a whole are what it is all about.

Re: US Election 2016
 

That is very nicely said

Re: US Election 2016
 

Nothings gonna change we just have to deal with it

Re: US Election 2016
 

Or the countries that want a free ride on defense. Have the US Navy patrol the seas but never pay for any it.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Since the thread topic is the US Election 2016, which candidate is going to implement any of the suggestions?

Not read a comment on that.

:pop2

Re: US Election 2016
 

The irony of 'defense' meaning invading Iraq and Afghan.

No please stop defending us, fairly certain you made it worse lol

Re: US Election 2016
 

LOL, You know....no one from Iraq asked to be saved! but remember, We went in to protect the oil! Funny, 90% of the hijackers were from Saudi Arabia and yet we didn't invade Saudi Arabia.....must of been a typo in the war papers.

Re: US Election 2016
 

The problem with what you suggested is that with any new technology, the jobs that get replaced simply create new, different jobs. For example, if in 2 years, all Waiter and Waitress jobs are replaced by robots, guess what? Someone is going to have to program, debug, repair, maintain, polish, and update these robots. This will eliminate some jobs, yes, but these other technical tasks won't take care of themselves. Unless, of course, you're theorizing a self-programming robot that also repairs other robots, in which case, we have a lot bigger problems to worry about than the economy. :pound:

As for the election topic, personally, I'd rather discuss the overarching problems of society. This is something there is a lot more middle ground on, and people are far less emotional about their overall world-views than the candidates themselves, generally speaking. I think this line of conversation is more fun and less harmful than the "SANDERS IS A COMMUNIST JEW!" And "TRUMP IS A RACIST OLD EVIL BIGOT!" :argue: :smash:

But that's just my opinion.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Aside from that, I think we all know deep down that NONE of the candidates would be able to "fix" the problems that exist, regardless of what they may be or how sincere they are in their desire to.

Both of the extreme candidates are hated so much by the establishment and their parties, that even if they managed to win the popular vote, the odds of shenanigans and or and assassination are just ridiculous.

I think the biggest positive to come from this election is opening the eyes of the American people, to see that our "democracy" is a farce.

Though judging from the response of the Edwards Snowden reveal, nothing will come of it.

Re: US Election 2016
 

This is the slow approach to things :d

Re: US Election 2016
 

If I remember correctly Tony Blair was all rah rah to go join the fight. Sorry but the politicians in the UK are as corrupt even not even more than States. What the three headed monster of Cameron, Osborne and Carney is going to crash the UK as bad if not worse than Janet Yellen over here.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Why would we invade Suadi? We have had to kiss their behind ever since Henry Kissinger make a backroom deal to save the USD by creating the Petro Dollar and agreeing to defend the House of Saud. After 1971 when Nixon Closed the Gold window the USD went is crapper. Jimmy Carter had to issue "Carter Bonds" to be paid back in Swiss Francs and West German Deutschmarks. No Petro Dollar no USD as worlds reserve currency.

They don't teach that kind of stuff in the K-12 Government indoctrination camps in America.

Re: US Election 2016
 

Tony Blair was a good leader for the UK at the time, but he made a major mistake in leading the UK into war. It a blight on his time as PM

As for corruption in UK politics, I would be interested to hear where you get that we are more corrupt than the US from? What makes something corrupt is half the time a subjective view.

All countries do have a level of corruption without a doubt, but we simply don't have the same sort of lobby and special interest groups as the US, no where else in the world does. Added to that half our laws are decided outside the UK (something that may well change in the coming months) so there simply isn't the same scope for corruption.

I spent a few years living in the US and I really enjoyed it. The US has some really great things, but US politics I found to not be one of them (that is just a subjective view). I found it very interesting how long it would take for a bill to pass, and then when it nearly did some special provision would be added to the bill which would see it end up failing quite often.

I am not really one for US bashing, something that does seem popular these days, I do think that there are a lot of things that the US do that I wish we did in the UK. I do think though that saying that we have the same type/level of corruption in the UK as the US is incorrect though

Both countries do pretty well on the transparency.org table though, so while both countries have got their corruption its a lot lot less of an issue than most of the rest of the world at least!

That seems unlikely. We have decent growth at the moment and they are bringing in some good solid reforms for the welfare system, immigration and taxes. Time will ultimately tell though

Re: US Election 2016
 

Unfortunately this common misconception is now prevalent across the internet as a whole. Socialism is a mode of production in which the means of production are owned by the working classes i.e. those who sell their labour in return for a wage, they are also categorised by being planned economies, these are not market driven. Capitalism is a mode of production in which the means of production are privately owned, these are market driven economies which are mainly categorised by having wage labour, production for profit etc.

Welfare does not equal socialism. Whilst you didn't state this in your post, the misconception of "free stuff" being thrown in a few posts needs to be addressed. Take the NHS for example - it's free at the point of access. These things are still being paid for by taxes.