amazon wants tin number

[alwaystrying]

That is what I will be doing..I have no choice I have exhausted every option years ago.

[thedickbib]

Originally Posted by DHB123

I have a question....
A seller who exceeds 50 sales, needs to provide tax info to Amazon. If they exceed 200(I have exceeded 200) the IRS becomes involved.
Amazon states anyone who does comply with the new regulations will have their accounts suspended until they comply.
My question is:
If I do not comply, and Amazon suspends me, Will they still come after me for taxes?
In other words, is there a risk of Amazon sending the information they have on me into the IRS, if I do not submit the required forms?

the reporting threshold is 200 transactions and 20K in gross sales. If you have not made 20K in gross sales and get suspended I would guess you would be OK.

[DHB123]

I've exceeded 20,000 in sales in my good account. My bath would have been far worse, if not for the fact my others sales were spread over stealth accounts. As much as I am sorry to see those accounts go, I can always create more. If I understand correctly, I can continue to sell (until Dec) on them, as long as I keep below the 200 item limit?
If that being the case, I can continue to sell on them and leave my good account alone. This may help me out as I believe a lot of my competition will disappear.
MY markup is good, so I'll continue with stealth and the one account which is free and above board. I buy my own inventory, so those accounts may be of more then one use.
I'd like to thank the users of this forum for their sound advice.

[ploughman]

I'd also have to chime in that this issue cries out for some guidance of some kind here, even if it's just sharing stories of approaches taken and what seemed to work and what didn't. The problem could be as much of a threat to some as suspensions.

Also, many people out there might not be too far above that $20K threshold, so consulting with professionals, while advisable, doesn't always get done (at least as a first resort) because of cost.

It seems that Amazon is setting an unreasonably low threshold at 50 transactions, given how many low-dollar items they have for sale. You could easily do that many and still be under $1,000, when the IRS is really looking at $20K and up. Seems as if Amazon is using this as an excuse to collect SSNs, shut down accounts and otherwise become very controlling. They deserve to be "rewarded" with lots of administrative headaches and complaints, as I'd bet the majority of those at 50+ transactions are still neither $20K in revenues nor full-time. You can easily hit that just doing it for side income. It could be a real revenue loser if it runs off sellers.

[beaches]

Iam going to hit and run. I have no choices.

[sarah74]

I have not reached 200 items yet but how do I confirm this exactly...

[hardtobelegit]

Originally Posted by kev59

Ok I am going to be logical ." Since we are simple for being stealth, mind you having already used our real names and have been suspended I guess when certain users are telling us to go Legit it must mean the following:

A.) Use a friend or family member's "LEGIT" info that way we can use a real SSN# or TIN# thus screwing them with the IRS among other things like their credit.

B.) Hopefully Amazon have forgotten or better yet scratched our real names off their "Blacklist" thus allowing us a second Chance.....NOT!!

C.) Forget this stealth thing altogether and that this Stealth thing including this website never even existed and it was all a part of our Imagination.

Maybe someone else might chime in with other suggestions.

This situation and how it plays out, will be very interesting indeed.:-)

The things I'm looking forward to are the challenge and the rewards. I plan on being one of the "crafty" sellers left to absorb the undoubtedly 'increased profits' due to marked up prices. As we know, this increased profit margin will be in direct result of 'less craftier" or "lazier" sellers giving up.:-)

The fact that Amazon asks for TIN instead of SSN should tell us something. This IRS thing is a REQUIREMENT and Amazon is doing damage control because they do not want to lose a lot revenue as a result of this. They are quite aware of the many fraudulent accounts active on there site. They play with us like mice, eliminating this one or that one for the overall good of the business. It isnt about the customers or the sellers more than it is about Amazon's bottom line.

Think about it like this; If you get caught with thousands in stolen merchandise and the victim from which it was stolen doesn't come forward, the law states, "No Victim, No Crime". Amazon operates in a similar sense. 'Let the mice do what they will as long as we profit from it.' That is why it only takes one customer to complain to get you shut down! Amazon knows its business depends a lot on bogus accounts and they consider this in their calculations.

The math is simple. AmazonGhost and other books like it, has taught thousands the tricks to getting back on amazon. Many are using these techniques to sell bogus merchandise, thus creating a more watered down marketplace. This method is pissing off thousands more customers.

So, suffice it to say, once the determined sellers find the loopholes they can rest in knowing that a lot of their competition will have been successfully weeded out. Why share the secrets if the end result will be Amazon evolving again?

I can guarantee that Aspkin hasn't conveyed every thing he knows about Amazon in his book. Him and those closest to him may reap the benefits of that. (Wish I was one) Even If it is by having a more competitive 'edge' selling on Amazon or being able to 'update' the ebook for more $$. It is a smart tactic that allows unlimited avenues for new gimmicks and is used in all 'for profit business':-)

Don't get me confused I am not complaining and I don't knock it at all! I say if you work hard, you should enjoy the fruits of your labor. And I can definitely appreciate anybody who resents the ones who work little and reap the benefits of this forum. So, It is now 'crunch time'. This is going to separate the hard workers from the coattail riders'. Good luck to us all!:-)

'FOCUSED ON BECOMING A MASTER STEALTH BOMBER'

[MrA]

Originally Posted by sarah74

I have not reached 200 items yet but how do I confirm this exactly...

Just do a search for transactions and make the range for the last year.

Amazon anounced this in 2009. But I never thought they would require sellers that have over 50 transactions to report.

I was averaging 150 a year with an average intake of $3500. I wonder what will happen when I don't give them my tax info, besides getting banned. I never filed a 1090 because my profit was only like $500 in a year, haha.

[ploughman]

I'm stealth on eBay, non-stealth on Amazon. Am under the $20K on eBay (though I'm getting the e-mail nags), but over it on Amazon.

I've always reported revenues and paid taxes on the money, even for stealth accounts, since 2002 (when the revenues first hit 4 figures).

I'm more concerned with Amazon having my SSN than I am with issues with the IRS, though this is shaping up to be a breakout year and I s'pose that alone could get them more curious about previous years.

My products have a small VERO risk, i.e. maybe 1 to 1.5 average complaints a year on eBay (across a 500+ item inventory) that drags the "compliance" metric to medium occasionally but hasn't sunk the account since that account's inception in 2006. If there's a tolerance factor on eBay it's within that (and the complaints may not be legit, but I don't think I'll ever get the complainer to see it that way).

Feels like walking through a very sparse minefield, and I'm not sure how much I gain from giving something other than SSN to Amazon. If the worst happens and the Amazon account goes down, would it be easier to get back with a different TIN, EIN or other number?

I also would have great difficulty churning the accounts at a 50 threshold, as I'd need 2 a week for some weeks. (Average sale might be $12 in final value). Would be nice to drop a widget in a bubble mailer at $100 each, but it seems that's what everyone's trying to do.

[rsot]

Very true,

[Ugly fish]

So,I am new the the blocked world and working on setting up my 1st "stealth" account. I would like to use the slow and stead approach as I have legitimate product to sell,so I will have to comply with the TIN/EIN as I would like to be on long enough to have such problems (LOL) I was wondering if I used my husbands info is that an option ? Also, would be selling same items as before-has anyone had issues with this?

[DHB123]

i have one good account (non stealth) and a couple of stealth. The stealth are disposable and can be replaced. The new tax regs suck, but I believe I can find a good use for the stealth accounts. I buy my inventory and have my own shipping. I will get a receipt for my yearly shipping and purchasing. I should be able to declare these amounts as inventory and shipping cost for the non stealth account. This would be a considerable deduction. I would appreciate any advice, from the more astute sellers....
btw..ugly fish, I would be very careful about listing the exact same items.

[Ugly fish]

Thanks- I was thinking of starting with a new line and and in as I go the things I sold before.

[oblong]

Originally Posted by GreenBean™

Taxes are still going to be payable, regardless of what happens.

Has that sunk in yet?

So the whoppin' 30% taxes will only not be payable when a TIN is given, in the same automatic style Amzn reportedly takes it from international dropshippers?

Or payable only when a TIN is given, by which time it's left to each dropshipper to declare his or her own taxes?

[Topdog]

Hi everybody I am new here.. I have a couple amazon accts. I've been using mail boxes and DBA bank accounts to avoid giving my name and address as I was banned in the past with my personal info. My question is can you give the IRS your DBA info to get an EIN?
And also use the same DBA info when filling out the amazon irs interview form?

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.. Thank you

[exranger]

I think one aspect is getting misunderstood here. Yes, you can get EINs, etc., easily, but they will be linked to people - you - in one way or another. The question isn't about paying taxes, I am all for that, and being legit. The question is: Can those TINs be linked to YOU, by AMAZON? We all know the IRS can, which is fine, but can AMAZON??

[Gamefreak]

The real question is will amazon go as far as it needs to link those TIN/EIN to sellers.

[exranger]

And the answer is?!?!

[MrMondo]

A few years ago I got closed down by Amazon for doing something I shouldna. Learned my lesson and got back on by using a friend's address and a DBA. Things have been going great, and I thought that by using an EIN instead of my SSN they wouldn't link back to my previous (real) identity. But I just went to give Amazon the information, and they want my tax reporting information as on file with the IRS - not just my DBA but my name and address. I don't think I have time to create a new address and get it on file with the IRA, let alone a name. It's possible, I suppose, that the Amazon computers may not cross check my information against their blacklist, but I don't want to take that chance. The only way I can see around this is to incorporate, in which case I only have to give Amazon the corporate info and not my personal info. Just hope I still have enough time to do that (and yes, I'm kicking myself for having let it go this late).

[KingRay]

Originally Posted by thedickbib

only thing I can think of so far that might work is to go combo legit and partial stealth. Partial stealth for amazon after Dec. 26th - legit to avoid issues with the IRS.

Try getting a box at a mail boxes etc. type place in a different town than your original suspended account that will be a regular looking street address as opposed to a PO Box address and set up a stealth account based on this address using a variation of your real name so it won't be totally out of line with your new TIN. Use your middle name as your first name or something along those lines. If your name that got suspended is William Joseph Smith call yourself Liam Smith or Joe Smith. Use stealth everything else. That may be enough to fool amazon.

Once you get back on amazon and start making sales apply for an EIN with your real IRS info and the new box address as the business address.

If you are making over 20K you are simply going to have pay your taxes. if you are making under 20K you are gong to have to think long and hard it about it.

I know paying taxes on under 20K is the right thing to do and the smart thing to do but it worries me if all the sudden you start reporting this income in 2012 it will trigger the IRS to start looking backwards for more. If there is no 1099-K form going to the IRS it might be better to let sleeping dogs lie.

Thats all fine with the EIN name change thing but if they do what paypal is doing now and making sure the name is exactly the same on the account as to the one on the IRS info then you are screwed.

I tried name alterations and got busted with each and every one of them now and had to come up with new ideas.

[KingRay]

Originally Posted by ploughman

I'd also have to chime in that this issue cries out for some guidance of some kind here, even if it's just sharing stories of approaches taken and what seemed to work and what didn't. The problem could be as much of a threat to some as suspensions.

Also, many people out there might not be too far above that $20K threshold, so consulting with professionals, while advisable, doesn't always get done (at least as a first resort) because of cost.

It seems that Amazon is setting an unreasonably low threshold at 50 transactions, given how many low-dollar items they have for sale. You could easily do that many and still be under $1,000, when the IRS is really looking at $20K and up. Seems as if Amazon is using this as an excuse to collect SSNs, shut down accounts and otherwise become very controlling. They deserve to be "rewarded" with lots of administrative headaches and complaints, as I'd bet the majority of those at 50+ transactions are still neither $20K in revenues nor full-time. You can easily hit that just doing it for side income. It could be a real revenue loser if it runs off sellers.

The IRS is NOT just looking for 20k and up accounts. they require you to report EVERYTHING. Those companies are simply required to report anything over that amount since there was no threshold set prior to now. No where has any company said anything about filing under 20k yet. I feel if you opened any type of business account you will be reported at any dollar amount. They havent said that you will not have a 1099 sent for $4k or 8k. They just said they are required to report over 20k. They can and probably will report all transactions if you are listed as a business.

Just watch. if not this year they will next year.

[Gamefreak]

So has anyone supplied amazon with their legit info on a stealth yet? If so how is it working out?

Success/failure?