PayPal's damages caused by Acceptable Use Policy violation

[JimboJim]

I read the user agreement for many countries such as Canada, USA, India and South Africa, and all of them includes the "You acknowledge and agree that $2,500.00 U.S. dollars per violation of the Acceptable Use Policy is presently a reasonable minimum estimate of PayPal's actual damages" in the User Agreement.

However one thing I have noticed that, in the UK User Agreement, it doesn't say anything about any fines of $2,500 USD or £2,500 GBP or €2,500 EUR for each violation of the Acceptable Use Policy. Also checked Germany's User Agreement and couldn't find anything either about a fine for violating the Acceptable Use Policy either.

Do you think the laws are different in the EU & UK that they can't just take money like that from people without actual reason?

Has anyone from the EU or UK got hit with this fine?

All I've seen is people from USA, Canada or Vietnam getting hit with these fines but couldn't find anyone online from UK or EU.

[Wesker]

Here is yet another case reported on the paypal community pages

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/...se/m-p/1969217





This member is in Vietnam.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by JimboJim

I read the user agreement for many countries such as Canada, USA, India and South Africa, and all of them includes the "You acknowledge and agree that $2,500.00 U.S. dollars per violation of the Acceptable Use Policy is presently a reasonable minimum estimate of PayPal's actual damages" in the User Agreement.

However one thing I have noticed that, in the UK User Agreement, it doesn't say anything about any fines of $2,500 USD or £2,500 GBP or €2,500 EUR for each violation of the Acceptable Use Policy. Also checked Germany's User Agreement and couldn't find anything either about a fine for violating the Acceptable Use Policy either.

Do you think the laws are different in the EU & UK that they can't just take money like that from people without actual reason?

Has anyone from the EU or UK got hit with this fine?

All I've seen is people from USA, Canada or Vietnam getting hit with these fines but couldn't find anyone online from UK or EU.

It's a small sample size of cases right now. Vietnam doesn't have any exclusive country base terms of service. However as of now no EU based accounts I have seen have had fines like this. Doesn't mean it hasn't happened.

[fiercygoat]

Originally Posted by Wesker

Here is yet another case reported on the paypal community pages

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/...se/m-p/1969217





This member is in Vietnam.

OMG, we must do something about this. It's insane how ruthlessly are taking money away now from Paypal accounts. We have to reunite and fight back. It feels like Paypal had enough with all the Paypal scammers and now are trying to get some kind of revenge. They want to show who's the boss, and enough with playing games and being too nice. They felt like they had become a laughingstock and were too soft all these years, allowing all kinds of scams to go rampant. Too bad for them that now it's kind of too late for them and whatever they do, won't bring back ebay. They lost the game. Ebay doesn't trust them anymore.

[BleepBloop]

Vietnam and countries that do not have their exclusive TOS listing do have a TOS called, "Other countries". And it does have that provision in it, btw:

"You agree that $2,500.00 USD (or equivalent) per transaction in violation of the Acceptable Use Policy is presently a reasonable minimum estimate of PayPal’s actual damages considering all currently existing circumstances, including the relationship of the sum to the range of harm to PayPal that reasonably could be anticipated because due to the nature of the violations of the Acceptable Use Policy, actual damages would be impractical or extremely difficult to calculate. PayPal may deduct such damages directly from any existing balance in the offending Account, or any other Account you control."

[james_112233]

Can't get over how much money paypal are just taking away from people. 10k, 20k, 30k, 40k at a time ? insanity. I would fall ill if they just took my money like that.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by james_112233

Can't get over how much money paypal are just taking away from people. 10k, 20k, 30k, 40k at a time ? insanity. I would fall ill if they just took my money like that.

Are you also having this same issue?

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by BleepBloop

Vietnam and countries that do not have their exclusive TOS listing do have a TOS called, "Other countries". And it does have that provision in it, btw:

"You agree that $2,500.00 USD (or equivalent) per transaction in violation of the Acceptable Use Policy is presently a reasonable minimum estimate of PayPal’s actual damages considering all currently existing circumstances, including the relationship of the sum to the range of harm to PayPal that reasonably could be anticipated because due to the nature of the violations of the Acceptable Use Policy, actual damages would be impractical or extremely difficult to calculate. PayPal may deduct such damages directly from any existing balance in the offending Account, or any other Account you control."

Yes this is what PayPal is doing here. Fining $2500 per transaction.

Essentially they can fine you an unlimited amount of money and drain your entire paypal of all funds.

[Viet Pham]

Originally Posted by Wesker

When was your guys fines? Mine was on Nov 26.

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/...on/m-p/1968997

This guy was Nov 26.

Wonder if the connection is somebody did this all on Nov 26.

Mine was on 26th Nov as well.

[Wesker]

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/...se/m-p/1971981

Another case

[JinK]

Originally Posted by Viet Pham

Mine was on 26th Nov as well.

Same you on 26th Nov, 13k$ was transfer to Paypal

[james_112233]

Originally Posted by Wesker

Are you also having this same issue?

No because I try not to keep anything over £200 $300 at any one time. Just enough to cover a refund.

I don't understand why anyone would want to keep thousands at any one time. It's madness. You know your account is created with made up details so it's a pure gamble. Better off putting the money on black or red on roulette.

[rsot]

Originally Posted by Viet Pham

Mine was on 26th Nov as well.

Welcome to the forum - all the best as you master stealth

[ALOHA]

Originally Posted by Wesker

Did you have the same issue?

Same issue.
I have 2 account, total ~ 60k USD.

damn it :|

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by ALOHA

Same issue.
I have 2 account, total ~ 60k USD.

damn it :|

How do you plan to resolve it?

[don toliver]

PayPal have recently been reporting to credit bureaus because their PayPal Credit got bought by a different company. Is it a coincidence that these cases are happening simultaneously? Perhaps because of the acquisition from the other company, they are forcefully taking money from limited accounts to offset all the losses they incurred. PayPal used to not care or do anything about it, but now that another company has their hands in it... Maybe that company is making PayPal be less lenient.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by don toliver

PayPal have recently been reporting to credit bureaus because their PayPal Credit got bought by a different company. Is it a coincidence that these cases are happening simultaneously? Perhaps because of the acquisition from the other company, they are forcefully taking money from limited accounts to offset all the losses they incurred. PayPal used to not care or do anything about it, but now that another company has their hands in it... Maybe that company is making PayPal be less lenient.

September is when they started doing this.

We aren't sure yet why PayPal is doing this. Obviously something recently changed inside PayPal because they only started doing this in September per reports online.

[Wesker]

Has anyone reached out to PayPal about this yet?
Has anyone got any information why PayPal did this other than the memo?

[Wesker]

Yet another case



https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/...on/m-p/1973826

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

Why are you posting them here? Nobody can help, (some of us don't care TBH), the majority of us are running stealth accounts and see paypal as a necessary evil and manage it as best we can. That's the purpose of this forum, not to go on some anti-paypal crusade using our phake ID!

1. If you don't care, don't post. Problem solved. Others do especially with so much money on the line. I'm posting to build up evidence, provide feedback before we legally arbitrate a case against PayPal which is ultimately where I see this going eventually.

2. You have 0 evidence to support your claim they are running stealth accounts and I have seen no evidence that any of the accounts subject to these fines were stealth accounts. The only information we have is PayPal made these deductions because they were violations of their AUP policy.

Not sure the purpose of you posting this. Derailing the thread with negativity is all you did in your last reply.

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

Never.....gonna......happen.

I'm commenting because I dont think folk should get suckered into sharing their account details with fellow scammers. Give help and info to anonymous individuals yes, but encourage off forum pipe-dreams, sorry I wont encourage folk to do that.

Actually been talking to Amazon seller dispute attorneys about possibly handling this that have helped in the past with Amazon issues on our tangible businesses that we still work actively with Amazon today on. So yes pre arbitration discussions could be a route we go or at least myself if I don't go another direction. Just to be clear, I didn't mean we will take PayPal to arbitration. Obviously if I seek legal counsel over this matter we'd hope to reach a resolution with PayPal before it ever even comes close to arbitration.

Also who is asking people for account details and who are these fellow scammers?

[Wesker]

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

(those who's screenshots you've shared without their knowledge)

It's publically available on the paypal community websites. Why can't I screenshot it?

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

to make that meeting and cough up for legal fees.

It's simply an idea or proposal if people want to do it. As of now, nobody seems interested except one in the United States which I contacted on the PayPal Community Website.

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

Most will be breaking paypals terms, so any brief worth their salt wont touch them, this forum is about helping them get a new start and avoiding the same mistakes.

I don't really know what these others did.

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

If you have been wronged then take them to task, just don't look for others to share your fees.

I believe I have been wronged. My accounts are legit with PayPal, I was never told what I breached in the 1st place since I sell hundreds of different items and services it could have been anything. They never let me withdrawal the funds and won't communicate on what this damage fine is about. I tried to appeal during the limitation and just received a generic reply. I moved on because we don't necessarily rely on PayPal for our business. Obviously extremely pissed off here with PayPal for not letting us part ways with them properly and professionally instead just taking our funds without any explanation.

Originally Posted by tinsoldier

just don't look for others to share your fees.

I can cover it myself if need be. It's going to cost a $2.5k retainer and upwards to $10k if it goes to arbitration.

However as of now my plan is just to wait and here what others have done/did before I proceed with anything. I am in no rush to get this resolved, will handle this properly, and something I will end up pursing in 2020.