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Old 02-19-2019
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Post [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Hello everyone,

Although a new user, I've been absorbing as many threads on this site as possible over the past few weeks, in an attempt to overturn a PERMANENT LIMITATION, made brutally clear by the unexpected email, titled "You can no longer do business with PayPal" and having your funds held "for up to 180 days".

Have you also been banned from PayPal?

Just to make sure this message gets to the intended audience, here's an overview of the situation:

** Start Point: Permanent Limitation (No appeal permitted & 180-day hold)
** End Result: Success (Account Restored)
** Resolution Time: 19 days (13 working days)
** Account Type: Business (registered to a UK Limited company)
** Business Type: Virtual Services (no goods, no shipping, no tracking)
** Balance Held: $10,000+ USD

Why share the experience?

I wanted to share this experience as it's only thanks to other success stories I found on this site, that inspired me to not give up and accept PayPal's decision, especially if you did abide by their User Agreement. The other main reason is that most posts I found helpful were just so old (always dated 2012 and below). PayPal can only get worse each year, while still sadly getting more customers and thus more victims of limitations. This is what made me question whether I should even be inspired by the old posts I was reading mostly, as PayPal may have easily and unsurprisingly evolved to meet their profit objectives through the use of unjustified limitations and 180-day holds.

https://www.aspkin.com/forums/uk-eba...ebay-back.html (Similar situation, although it's from 2012)
https://www.aspkin.com/forums/ebay-d...-restored.html (The tips here were especially useful)

You're not the only one

If you've recently joined the club for permanent limitations, I most certainly know how you feel - rest assured that you have found the right site for advice. Once I received the dreaded email saying our company could no longer do business with PayPal, I could not be in a lower place at the time; I had literally created a company (in London, UK) just for PayPal's sake, to provide further confidence and assurance in order to "guarantee" a long and healthy relationship for our growing business. Well, it turns out that a registered Ltd company (in one of the most regulated regions in the world) doesn't do the trick in keeping PayPal happy. More to the point, I just felt like closing the company, even with knowledge of alternative payment processors. Although PayPal are absolute thieves and destructive when you least need it, they are indeed the most popular payment processor and thus the most attractive to your customers. If in like our case PayPal was your only payment method (for both sales and purchases), then you may feel like your life is over and no longer have the confidence to carry out any business, or perhaps fulfill your dream of working for yourself, even if it's just a hobby.

Well don't give up just yet, as long as:
1) you are not in the wrong (according to their User Agreement)
2) you are theoretically able to prove every payment in or out (e.g. supplier invoices and extensive proof of fulfillment, as the idiot who closed your account is just a human and may not even know of your industry/service)
3) you don't have a history of limited accounts on your name (as there's a clearly stated policy about this I'm afraid)

What caused the limitation?

Account limitations are usually triggered after one of PayPal's algorithms detect a spike or abnormality in your account activities - this will flag your account on PayPal's system for essentially an emergency review, which is why limitations usually happen a few short hours following a spike. In our case, it was increasing our withdrawal amount by 50% for the first time, compared to a fixed amount that we had been using since we opened the account. It seems kind of understandable, but that also means all of PayPal's users are either under stress to keep to their exact pattern, or else are inviting PayPal to limit their account and most likely close it due to "risk". Our particular limitation requested the following:

- Upload a photo ID
- Provide your business information
- Provide proof of fulfillment
- Provide purchase receipt from your supplier

Our account was banned the next day.

File a complaint in the US

Before I even proceed, if your PayPal account was created in the US then there is no need for you to suffer, since you already have a dedicated portal to the most prestigious department at PayPal HQ, which is through the Better Business Bureau (or BBB). Be grateful - you are the only ones with this privilege to get a super helpful (and not to mention, guaranteed) reply from a boss. The Office of Executive Escalations will handle your complaint with priority and literally conduct a thorough review just to address your matter in the most helpful way. I know this because I tried it anyway, even though our account was created out of their jurisdiction; you can also view most of their complaints along with PayPal's response to each of them (which is where I saw - for the first time - PayPal explaining their reasons and observations about limited accounts).

I was truly jealous when I found out about the BBB - even if they weren't going to restore my account, I would be over the moon to find out why it was closed in the first place! It would at least grant you the opportunity to "get it right" the next time, if possible, depending on your case. One policy of theirs which I can't really challenge is their right to suspend an account on the basis of having previously limited accounts - it's a fair rule, but it also means you would need to fight for yourself when your account runs into trouble (assuming you done nothing wrong or that can't be proven), instead of the "give up and go stealth" approach, which a lot of people on this forum prefer understandably (as it's quick and easy). In our case, as a registered company, there's not really much of a solution to "hiding" from PayPal if we were to open a new account, hence our attempts to get our account restored.

Enough talk - here's the steps for US victims (but feel free to try it if you're non-US based, as it will likely be forwarded by PayPal HQ to a department that must surely be able to help - it's one extra hope, so why not):

1) Start at https://www.bbb.org/us/ca/san-jose/p...nc-1216-210387 (you can view some of their complaints and responses if you wish, so you know what I mean about them going to great depths unlike any other means of contact)
2) Click "File a Complaint", then "Start your complaint".
3) Where it asks "Is the business in the United States or Canada?", always select "Yes", even if your account was created in another country (as they still have no choice but to respond and in our case, they forwarded our complaint to PayPal's North America Executive Escalations office, but I can't confirm whether this helped in any way)
4) Where it says "Your complaint involves a:", select "business's product or service (other than a vehicle or cell phone)".
5) On the next page, you'll have to search for the business; just type "PayPal" and hit 'Search'. Clicking 'Select' on the first search result will prompt you to specify which of PayPal's offices to file the complaint to - unless you have a reason to choose a specific address, select the San Jose one (2211 North First Street, San Jose, CA 95131)
6) The rest is up to you to explain your matter to PayPal (see below for crucial tips on how to address them). After submitting the complaint, wait a day or two for them to respond and you should be able to find out everything you wanted to know. If not, you should be able to continue exchanging messages as deemed necessary.

File a complaint in the UK

So what's the UK equivalent of the BBB, you may ask?

That would be the Financial Ombudsman Service! It may look like it's built by a 5-year old, but it's all we got...

Here's the link: https://help.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/help
When asked to provide details of the business, just write "PayPal" and they will handle everything else personally; in our case, they eventually reached out to us by email with "PayPal Europe Sarl & Cie, SCA" in the subject, so it was good to see a human was dealing with it, even though it takes a lot longer to process. The email we received was asking for the formal complaint letter that was sent to PayPal, however, we got this email just 2 hours after our PayPal account was suddenly restored, so we didn't proceed any further.

I honestly don't know whether it was a coincidence that PayPal and the Financial Ombudsman Service emailed us at around the same time, although I have already enquired about whether they took any action prior to their email and will update this post, if possible, once I find out.

Addressing PayPal

Despite reading advice not to beg or make threats, it's really hard to do anything but that, especially when the news of your account limitation comes as a shock to you - even I, could not help myself at the start but keep making threats of taking legal action and expressing frustration to their Facebook and Twitter teams. Well, here's what I learned from that (while getting my Twitter account suspended in the process):

1) Don't let anger hinder your chances. At the end of the day, the people you message at PayPal are the only ones who are going to help you - don't give them a reason to skip your message. You have to assume every email or other form of contact is going to be the key to unlock your account because one of them will be, if successful.

2) DO NOT beg or show desperation. PayPal could not care less if you or someone's life is on the line, hanging by a thread or has annihilated your business. They exist to please shareholders, not customers (although, pleasing customers is just something they have to do to achieve that).

3) Hang up the phone. Calling PayPal is not going to get you anywhere other than where you started. I was so hopeless about their call centers, that I never called once during this whole process. The easy options are the least effective because they are the ones used most by customers. Don't forget, PayPal employs bots and monkeys to handle the majority of their queries (especially when using their 'Contact Us' form), with limitations being a very common query. If you know what they're going to say, there's probably not much point even trying (not more than once at least).

4) With higher powers comes higher standards. Your best bet at getting your account restored is by emailing a more serious department at PayPal, which unfortunately means you have to prepare a really good email for them to take you seriously too. You'll want to take note of the following things as best you can:

- You are potentially talking to someone who's going to hear you out and determine if there's any point reviewing your account. In most cases and for good reason, you'll need to provide something more than just words, which are documents (that you haven't already sent them). Even if they don't open them, they will know you took the time to address your concern(s) and haven't just pasted some template you found on this site (which they surely know about).

- Speak the truth and cut the waffle. PayPal banned you due to perceived risk, so now it's time to go beyond the word counts and file limits from their limitation page - PayPal's mail server has a size limit, so consider uploading to Google Drive for example, then attaching a link where appropriate in the email. The documents I would advise on giving them are: ALL supplier invoices billed to the address on your PayPal account (helps if they were paid from your account), proof of fulfillment for as many orders as possible (easy if you use databases or spreadsheets) and finally, a business registration certificate is always golden if applicable (as they did not ever actually ask us for this - only the registration number).

- Structure your email. I won't provide the template which got our account restored and you should neither use any template that you find online if you want your account restored too. I have, however, attached an outline of the structure if you need one:

*** Start your email ***
{Express your understanding for the need to limit accounts, especially with digital services. Let them know you are familiar with the User Agreement and point out you have not violated any policy or law}
{Indicate that the account limitation didn't give a fair opportunity to explain your business model or provide adequate file space to upload "ALL" (<- important) the documents that were requested}
{Explain your business model in layman's terms (inc. website)}
{If you have any big, reputable customers (specifically companies), spice up your email by bringing them up (by name and PayPal email) to show they have been affected by the limitation}
{Tell them in order to fairly review the account, they should inspect the 'Order fulfillment proofs', 'Supplier invoices' and any 'Official business docs' you have attached (because the limitation page didn't provide sufficient space - anything to make it seem PayPal are to blame, without directly blaming them)}
{Time to wrap up the email, but by first being compliant, saying you are happy to provide any further documents or perform any steps if required}
{Something experimental we tried, is telling them that if "risk" is still a concern, then feel free to place a fixed or proportional amount of sales in the "reserve account" if they believe this provides the assurance they need (in cases of disputes). I'm guessing this is better than nothing for you, so why not - they already have the functionality to implement this on any account}

*** End your email ***

Recovering your funds early I would consider a less major goal (as it's just a matter of time, not a decision), so word-for-word templates may work for that, as mentioned below in the next point.

- If you're only looking to get your funds released at best, you might want to mention the legal options that you have "planned" in case of no resolve, but do it in a formal way, as suggested below:
UK: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/paypal...90-result.html (Confirmed in 2015)
US: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/625303-post8.html (Confirmed in 2014)

Mailing List: Where to send your formal emails

Once you've written a formal, concise email/letter, you've done the hard part and now it's time to send them out. You've probably already found the mailing list that literally every website copies and pastes, which you can find here: https://www.aspkin.com/forums/370291-post5.html.

Although this is the list we used, we only sent it to selected emails, so given that our account was restored, it may help if we narrowed down the list for you (as it's not recommended to make them all recipients of the same email at the same time). As we notice a lot of people on this forum asking about the response times from PayPal, we have also calculated the time period since the email was sent and when the account was restored. Although none of them provided a direct response, the timing hints at one winner.

aup@paypal.com | Day 1 | 19 days before restoring
appeals@paypal.com | Day 1 | 19 days before restoring
executiveoffice@paypal.com | Day 14 | 6 days before restoring (4 working days)
webform@intl.paypal.com | Day 15 | 5 days before restoring

webform@intl.paypal.com is a mailbox which simulates the 'Contact Us' form on PayPal's site as far as I know, which is reportedly handled in India with a range of template responses, meaning they have no authority over your account. They always answer you, but I don't think typing is part of their job description - you will always get the same response (being that their decision is final). I am not sure if it's just a preference of the agent or something relevant, but sometimes they reply with a longer template mentioning "Your right to appeal" that can be done through the 'Contact Us' form, however, our letters were a lot longer than the accepted character limit, so we never took this route.

So as that email was ruled out, it seemed kind of obvious that our account was restored as a result of our email to executiveoffice@paypal.com, which I should mention is not listed on the mailing list at the link provided - we only found this email from reading PayPal's responses on the BBB website, whereby they welcome anyone to send their complaints to that department.

To conclude

So that's where our story ends - we received an email from service@paypal.co.uk this morning saying that "We have completed our review, and as you have completed all the required steps, we have restored your account", which appears to be another template response!

I really hope this thread gives some hope as well as options and clarification to those who have run into the same issue. Don't be too negative if you have done nothing wrong and it's your one and only account - humans make mistakes, but with PayPal, it's just a tough one to undo. One formal letter is all that stands in your way, so I wish you all the best with preparing it and getting your account back despite what you may have been told - "permanently limited" is not the end of the road, even if you can't get your account back.

Last edited by HangInThere; 02-20-2019 at 08:19 AM.
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  #2  
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

It's really great post. Thanks for sharing. very informative.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Congratulations on getting your account back.

The lesson i'd take away from this is that putting all your eggs in one basket can jeopardise your business if you ever get limited again (and you can get limited again, though odds are less at this stage).

It's a good idea to open up multiple stealth accounts, spread sales, and put this account as a back burner (for now), or use it lightly.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Play View Post
Congratulations on getting your account back.

The lesson i'd take away from this is that putting all your eggs in one basket can jeopardise your business if you ever get limited again (and you can get limited again, though odds are less at this stage).

It's a good idea to open up multiple stealth accounts, spread sales, and put this account as a back burner (for now), or use it lightly.
I would definitely agree. Fortunately, I had a stable business account on my name for nearly 2 years that could cover while I was fighting with PayPal, which is odd because I have a long history of limited accounts - all I do is open a new bank account and I verify with the same name, address & photo ID and it's so far lasting nearly 2 years on one account (must be at least $500k turnover on it).

For obvious reasons, that's why I incorporated a company and made a family member the director and account holder, as the business has simply grown too big to have to worry about losing it's only payment gateway at any second. That's how I knew PayPal was in the wrong this time as there were no previously limited accounts for the holder, but of course, I will never really know what their reason was.

But yes, for sure, the lesson I would emphasize is to always expect the worst from PayPal and prepare for it in as many ways possible. Stripe is heaven in case anyone's interested - we're integrating it now and it's just so pleasant to work with. You'd think that PayPal was best at everything, but it's totally not the case.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Welcome to the forum - all the best as you master stealth

Incredible post.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

a lot of good information in here, congrats to you
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Interesting thread. I'll read through all of these when i got time in the weekend. Thanks! and congrats!
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Hi HangInThere

I recently bought a business that trades online in the UK (through our own site and ebay) and have had a busines paypal account for over 10 years.

I tried to change the main username on the account and provided all the requested personal data/information. Out of the blue I got an email on Sunday morning (2am) to say the account had been closed. Interestingly the email title was 'your appeal has been unsuccessful' - yet I hadn't appealed anything! No warning, nothing - the account was just simply closed.

I'm now left with a situation where my account has been closed with no apparent recourse/right of appeal + they have over 20k of my money too! I cannot process customer refunds either which is causing reputation damage too.

Can you just clarify: do you think the best approach is to email those addresses in your post or to complain to the financial ombudsman? Do you know which was the most influential in getting your account restored?

I'm contemplating messaging senior paypal people on LinkedIn too (I have a premium subscription so I can inmail people) do you happen to know which department I'd be best to try and locate or any senior guys to go after?

Thanks in advance for any insight you may have...
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidthepavid View Post
Hi HangInThere

I recently bought a business that trades online in the UK (through our own site and ebay) and have had a busines paypal account for over 10 years.

I tried to change the main username on the account and provided all the requested personal data/information. Out of the blue I got an email on Sunday morning (2am) to say the account had been closed. Interestingly the email title was 'your appeal has been unsuccessful' - yet I hadn't appealed anything! No warning, nothing - the account was just simply closed.

I'm now left with a situation where my account has been closed with no apparent recourse/right of appeal + they have over 20k of my money too! I cannot process customer refunds either which is causing reputation damage too.

Can you just clarify: do you think the best approach is to email those addresses in your post or to complain to the financial ombudsman? Do you know which was the most influential in getting your account restored?

I'm contemplating messaging senior paypal people on LinkedIn too (I have a premium subscription so I can inmail people) do you happen to know which department I'd be best to try and locate or any senior guys to go after?

Thanks in advance for any insight you may have...
Hey David,

Welcome to the forum. I'm glad you found this post - I'll be happy to assist you through this and hopefully get your account restored.

Based off what you provided, it's essentially the same experience we had with our company, as in, a very unexpected, frustrating, destructive and permanent ban. With 20k at stake, you'll certainly want to avoid taking the easy route of creating a new account for immediate relief, as there's no going back from that point - PayPal's policies are crystal clear in this regard, banning you for life on the basis of having previously limited accounts.

Another tip is to completely ignore the email or any content mentioning "no appeal" or "appeal unsuccessful". I know it seems like a dead end (especially to most people on this forum), but as mentioned in my post, you are still entitled to get a fresh look over your account (with your own explanation) from PayPal's Office of Executive Escalations, so focus your time on addressing them via formal letter/email (which took me a full day per draft).

Regarding the best approach, be encouraged to use all advice from the post when writing up your letter, with emphasis on point 1) and 2); do not let anger do the talking and don't mention filing complaints (yet), as this appears as a threat and desperation, which although may work to get your funds released, is not the way to go to restoring your account.

With filing complaints, once you have written up your formal letter, I don't see why not exercise your right to do so anyway, even while you're waiting on PayPal to give you an initial response. Your letter will essentially be a complaint, which is why in our case, we sent the same letters to PayPal as well as governing bodies (including US-based) on day 1; it can only improve your chances and in shorter time. The Financial Ombudsman Service is a very slow process, which is another reason to get that started as soon as possible for a worst case outcome from PayPal.

In case you misunderstood from the post, the department at PayPal who quite evidently got us restored was the Executive Office, reached at executiveoffice@paypal.com. The account was restored 4 working days after emailing them our (V2) letter, so this was the golden solution in our case.

The other 2 emails (aup@paypal.com and appeals@paypal.com) I believe are both also capabale of the same actions, however they neither replied nor took any any action (unless it took 3 weeks, which I doubt). With that said, we emailed these 2 departments on day 1 of being banned, so you can probably imagine that we were fuelled with anger and threats, hence where much of our advice comes from, as this may well be the reason they ignored the emails. Thank God we waited a week before reaching out to executiveoffice@paypal.com, whereby I spent another day re-writing the letter with a more professional tone, using the structure provided in the post.

I hope this helps as a starting point. You mentioned reaching out on LinkedIn, which you are of course welcome to try - every added person involved (whether from PayPal staff or governing body) is an extra chance of at least getting noticed, and eventually getting a well-informed review of your account.

Due to the limited information provided, I think that's the best advice I can give at the moment. For better guidance from any of us on this forum, it would help to know the following:

- The general nature of your business (physical/digital goods), and is it incorporated?
- Did the new business you bought cause a significant change to your usual PayPal sales pattern?
- Did you have a limitation prior to the ban, and if so, what was asked from you?
- Do you have any other PayPal accounts (whether personal or business, and are any limited)? Perhaps even, did the business have their own PayPal account?

This will just help identify if there are perhaps any justified concerns (or agreement violations) PayPal may have picked up on. It's quite important to understand and recognise the potential reasons they may have against you in order to make your letter effective and relevant, as they will most certainly not tell you this themselves.

All the best

Last edited by HangInThere; 03-06-2019 at 04:18 PM.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Hi thanks for getting back to me.

All good stuff - we got someone on LinkedIn from Paypal who suggested the executive escalations team, so I will send my email to them as suggested.

In terms of your other questions:

- We are an ecommerce retail business, selling consumer goods. It's a limited company and has been in business 15 years. Our paypal checkout volume has been fairly consistent for a number of years and our eBay account can fluctute depending on what stock we have access to. We have been doing consistently around 150k per month through the account.

- The only change since I bought it was we opened up an eBay Germany channel which brought some Euros into the account, but at a fraction of the GBP volumes.

- No limitations on the account as far as I am aware (I have been involved with the business for 3 years).

- I have a personal eBay account which is very rarely used and have had no previous issues with. The (now closed) account in question has always belonged to the limited company, obviously prior to me buying the business.

Anyway, thanks for taking time to get back - obviously not an ideal scenario having just bought a company!
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidthepavid View Post
Hi thanks for getting back to me.

All good stuff - we got someone on LinkedIn from Paypal who suggested the executive escalations team, so I will send my email to them as suggested.

In terms of your other questions:

- We are an ecommerce retail business, selling consumer goods. It's a limited company and has been in business 15 years. Our paypal checkout volume has been fairly consistent for a number of years and our eBay account can fluctute depending on what stock we have access to. We have been doing consistently around 150k per month through the account.

- The only change since I bought it was we opened up an eBay Germany channel which brought some Euros into the account, but at a fraction of the GBP volumes.

- No limitations on the account as far as I am aware (I have been involved with the business for 3 years).

- I have a personal eBay account which is very rarely used and have had no previous issues with. The (now closed) account in question has always belonged to the limited company, obviously prior to me buying the business.

Anyway, thanks for taking time to get back - obviously not an ideal scenario having just bought a company!
Hi David,

Thanks for providing this further insight.

If I understood correctly, your account closure didn't follow a limitation, so was just based on changes you made to your account? You mentioned providing "all the requested personal data/information", so I may have misunderstood the meaning of this (whether it was requested through a limitation or you actually changing personal details for the account holder). For the moment, I can see this being the issue, either by changing personal information of an already-verified account holder or providing information (especially of the company) that links to another account (perhaps of the former owner).

In any case, I'm glad to see you're on the right track by starting with the executive office of escalations - try to get that email sent this week for some potentially good news the following one. Would be great to hear an update if things work out!

Best of luck
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Old 03-06-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

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Originally Posted by HangInThere View Post
Hi David,

Thanks for providing this further insight.

If I understood correctly, your account closure didn't follow a limitation, so was just based on changes you made to your account? You mentioned providing "all the requested personal data/information", so I may have misunderstood the meaning of this (whether it was requested through a limitation or you actually changing personal details for the account holder). For the moment, I can see this being the issue, either by changing personal information of an already-verified account holder or providing information (especially of the company) that links to another account (perhaps of the former owner).

In any case, I'm glad to see you're on the right track by starting with the executive office of escalations - try to get that email sent this week for some potentially good news the following one. Would be great to hear an update if things work out!

Best of luck
Hey - yeah - absolutely no prewarning or limitations on the account. I can only think it was the change in owner's details that's triggered this. It's what makes it all the more frustrating...

I'll get that email off and let you know any update.

Cheers
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

I've tried you guide. My account is limited with 2K Eur all answers was this decision is final. Can you help me with the letter?
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Hey - I've had no luck following the above. Literally no acknowledgement of my email.

Any more advice/suggestions?

Who is the appropriate authority to complain to?

I've considered legal action, but the cost is prohibitive to simply retrieve money I will eventually get back...
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Old 03-21-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sashkin View Post
I've tried you guide. My account is limited with 2K Eur all answers was this decision is final. Can you help me with the letter?
Hello, and welcome to the forum!

I'd be happy to have a read through your letter to advise on what needs tweaking, BUT ONLY if:

1) you are not selling anything unlawful, unauthentic or prohibited by PayPal.
2) your sales and expenses are legitimately documented (with invoices etc).
3) you don't have a history of limited accounts on your name (as there's no chance of restoring in this case).

Don't explain your business model yet, as it should be easy to understand from the letter (just as a member at PayPal would have to). Please also let me know what emails you have messaged so far and how many working days since.

Thanks!

Last edited by SaiJin; 03-21-2019 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 03-21-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

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Originally Posted by davidthepavid View Post
Hey - I've had no luck following the above. Literally no acknowledgement of my email.

Any more advice/suggestions?

Who is the appropriate authority to complain to?

I've considered legal action, but the cost is prohibitive to simply retrieve money I will eventually get back...
Ah man, that sucks to hear!

Something that just crossed my mind, which I should have mentioned in the post, is that you most definitely need to include the Case ID in all your emails (even better if in the subject too). Messaging from the PayPal email address should be an obvious one.

What emails/departments did you contact? And how many working days since?

Regarding legal action, I'm sure you acknowledge that ends your relationship with PayPal for good. Our resolution took 19 days, so it should serve as a reminder that a lot of time and persistence is required to get your desired result. As business has likely ceased anyway, you should initiate as many processes as you can, which have all been outlined in the post (and that includes the US-specific, BBB website, even though you're in the UK - it did still open another door for us and has proven extremely helpful when complaining to other huge US companies).

Like you said, recovering funds is a matter of time, not a decision, so keep your focus on restoring for now. I'd be happy to help tweak your letter, as whoever at PayPal read it (or not) would have no other reference to understand your business and it's latest changes from A to Z. If not, no worries - I can instead send you our letter if you wish, to see how we approached it.
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Has anyone had success going through the BBB? I submited my appeal a couple of weeks ago and never received a response
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Old 04-23-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HangInThere View Post
I would definitely agree. Fortunately, I had a stable business account on my name for nearly 2 years that could cover while I was fighting with PayPal, which is odd because I have a long history of limited accounts - all I do is open a new bank account and I verify with the same name, address & photo ID and it's so far lasting nearly 2 years on one account (must be at least $500k turnover on it).

For obvious reasons, that's why I incorporated a company and made a family member the director and account holder, as the business has simply grown too big to have to worry about losing it's only payment gateway at any second. That's how I knew PayPal was in the wrong this time as there were no previously limited accounts for the holder, but of course, I will never really know what their reason was.

But yes, for sure, the lesson I would emphasize is to always expect the worst from PayPal and prepare for it in as many ways possible. Stripe is heaven in case anyone's interested - we're integrating it now and it's just so pleasant to work with. You'd think that PayPal was best at everything, but it's totally not the case.
Hello, thank you very much for all the info you are sharing.
I am fighting PayPal's nonsense limitation also but whatever will be the result, I am considering following ways to go on with my business. After PayPal limited my account I already started new one and linked my old Ebay account and they limited it few days later also.

Now I am thinking on how to go on with my business:

1) starting new ebay & paypal on new email but the old business details that got limited (my personal name, VAT number, etc)
2) starting new company and register new Ebay and PayPal accpimts on its name

I dont know if they can limit the new company just because I use the same IP address and my name is behind the company still. Thus if it wouldnt be wasted money to start another company and then get the business banned on paypal again anyway.

I see that you write you had experience with having your account limited and then just starting new PayPal accoutn on your name and it went without notice.
I want to ask if there were some steps you made in order to get your new account not linked with the old one?
Do you think using the old ebay account is the main reason they found out about my new account so fast? Or if changing my email account of the Ebay would help?
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Old 04-23-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingDutch View Post
Hello, thank you very much for all the info you are sharing.
I am fighting PayPal's nonsense limitation also but whatever will be the result, I am considering following ways to go on with my business. After PayPal limited my account I already started new one and linked my old Ebay account and they limited it few days later also.

I dont know if they can limit the new company just because I use the same IP address and my name is behind the company still. Thus if it wouldnt be wasted money to start another company and then get the business banned on paypal again anyway.

I see that you write you had experience with having your account limited and then just starting new PayPal accoutn on your name and it went without notice.
I want to ask if there were some steps you made in order to get your new account not linked with the old one?
Do you think using the old ebay account is the main reason they found out about my new account so fast? Or if changing my email account of the Ebay would help?
Hello, and welcome to the forum.

Unfortunately, if you've already made a new account on the same name as an immediate solution, then this guide probably becomes redundant (as you are now in violation of their "single account" policy and "can be banned on the basis of having other limited accounts"). I perfectly understand why you did though, especially when you rely on it for business.

I myself, have also just lived with creating new accounts and not appealing limitations (not with persistence at least), which means I'm screwed for life. It wasn't until recently when business got serious (from just a small hobby at University) that it then became a very critical step to success to have a long-lasting relationship with PayPal. No PayPal => No Business (at least in my case). This is why I felt that I must write this guide (and share the experience) on fighting PayPal for their mistakes, as you truly only get one chance to keep your name clear and business stable (which I screwed up from a young age).

With regards to how I handled account creations, I honestly took no care in faking my digital footprint, to the point that I would use the same computer, IP, browser (probably cookies too), name, verification documents and address (though I took the intuitive step of mixing up the address lines, re-ordering etc). The only hard work was opening a new bank account (as they remain forever linked when you're limited). Was I lucky? Probably. Did PayPal always know I had a history? I'm 99% sure they knew from the start, but as I was filling their pockets with fees, they must have turned a blind eye. Even to this day, my account is still open (on my name) after many years with tens of thousands of transactions, but that's a story for another day; I am probably going to pay the price one day with a chained limitation across my family/household.

Back to you... although I don't sell on eBay (as I'm banned there too), my understanding from reading this forum often is that you were most likely limited by linking a completely new PayPal account to an old eBay account. Even if your eBay account is all good, PayPal would have been able to create a link between your two accounts. Changing your eBay email will have absolutely no effect; as someone working with PayPal's API, I can assure that they identify you with unique IDs, not by email.

Quote:
1) starting new ebay & paypal on new email but the old business details that got limited (my personal name, VAT number, etc)
2) starting new company and register new Ebay and PayPal accpimts on its name
Regarding these plans of action, if you choose the first option, you would definitely need to consult the stealth guide which is provided on this forum (https://www.auctionstealth.com/) to ensure both eBay and PayPal cannot link your old accounts to your new ones.

The second option seems more like what I had done in this guide and I think it should work for you too. Before you do anything though, you need to try and understand why you were limited; I think it could be vaguely categorized into "unusual activity", "high risk" or "violation".

Unusual activity: Sudden spike in sales, large one-off transaction, etc.
High Risk: Digitial services is a common one, high chargeback rate etc.
Violation: Prohibited goods/services, counterfeit items, limited accounts etc.

I can't advise whether you should still try and appeal your original PayPal limitation, as you now have a second limited account which they can use against you. If you've got the time though, then why not follow the guide anyway and try your luck (mainly with executiveoffice@paypal.com). If you'd rather start fresh and are willing to battle future limitations with persistence (using this guide for example), then launch a new company, but use someone else's name for the company PayPal account. In my case, I am still using the same IP address to access the company account and my old one - I don't see how it can be a problem when multiple people (mainly on a household basis) share the same IP address.

Hope that helps!
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Old 04-23-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HangInThere View Post
Hello, and welcome to the forum.

Before you do anything though, you need to try and understand why you were limited; I think it could be vaguely categorized into "unusual activity", "high risk" or "violation".

Unusual activity: Sudden spike in sales, large one-off transaction, etc.
High Risk: Digitial services is a common one, high chargeback rate etc.
Violation: Prohibited goods/services, counterfeit items, limited accounts etc.
Thank you very much for the post! Actually I am not sure what exactly is the source of the problem or if it is the link between Ebay-PayPal
I have 3 PayPal accounts - one for company where I am co-owner, one that is for my business and I used lately for Ebay sales, and one that I didnt even know I had.
I received all the limitation emails from PayPal to my mail accounts within one hour:
First was to my company that I used to sell via Ebay 7 months back, nowadays it was kind of dead for few months, but few days before the limitation I started to receive payments also via my CZ eshop - in this mail they described the reason for limitation as "excessive risk involved"

Within 30 minutes from that I received an email to my mail address that I have for my personal business on PayPal and use for selling on Ebay (where I used to sell with the first company PayPal address just 7 months back) - here the reason for limiting was only that the paypal is linked to another limited account

Then within another 30 minutes I received another mail to my very old email address where I used to have PayPal many years back and never had it connected to any Ebay nor anything - and here the reason for limiting was also that it is linked to another limited account

Thus - are they going after my name only and not after the Ebay? Because the third email was never connected to any Ebay. Could I possibly use then this old Ebay account for brand new company without my name?

My theory is that they limited the company PayPal where they were used to receive $ from Ebay months back, and few days before limitation I started to receive there CZK from my czech eshop. Thus it triggered some of their computers as weird and bang, limited. As in this company I used everywhere my name (although I am not the only owner), I think they connected this company PayPal account with my personal business account via my name (and not via Ebay) and also with the prehistoric PayPal account that I almost forgot I even had.

As the only account that was limited because of some reason, other than being linked to another limited account, was my company PayPal and that happened most probably because of the new eshop sales, I am sitll in very slight hope that maybe I could get that one restored.

The new account I opened after having it limited was on my personal name so I didnt make the company PayPal account any dirty directly.

So I guess from what you write, it will be best to 1) keep trying to reach the PayPal from my company PayPal account clarifying the whole situation about new eshop, 2) keep trying to reach the PayPal also from my personal business account explaining that my personal business is not the company business and thus the accounts are not linked, and 3) at the same time start new personal business stealth accounts on Ebay and PayPal for the very probable scenario that they will do nothing?

Sorry for the long story.

PS: I also fu**ed my name with PayPal already years back when I was 15 and was trading with some crap from China and needed PayPal and thus falsely told them I was 18 and got banned later. So it is maybe surprise that they even left me free for long.
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  #21  
Old 04-30-2019
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingDutch View Post
Thank you very much for the post! Actually I am not sure what exactly is the source of the problem or if it is the link between Ebay-PayPal
I have 3 PayPal accounts - one for company where I am co-owner, one that is for my business and I used lately for Ebay sales, and one that I didnt even know I had.
I received all the limitation emails from PayPal to my mail accounts within one hour:
First was to my company that I used to sell via Ebay 7 months back, nowadays it was kind of dead for few months, but few days before the limitation I started to receive payments also via my CZ eshop - in this mail they described the reason for limitation as "excessive risk involved"

Within 30 minutes from that I received an email to my mail address that I have for my personal business on PayPal and use for selling on Ebay (where I used to sell with the first company PayPal address just 7 months back) - here the reason for limiting was only that the paypal is linked to another limited account

Then within another 30 minutes I received another mail to my very old email address where I used to have PayPal many years back and never had it connected to any Ebay nor anything - and here the reason for limiting was also that it is linked to another limited account

Thus - are they going after my name only and not after the Ebay? Because the third email was never connected to any Ebay. Could I possibly use then this old Ebay account for brand new company without my name?

My theory is that they limited the company PayPal where they were used to receive $ from Ebay months back, and few days before limitation I started to receive there CZK from my czech eshop. Thus it triggered some of their computers as weird and bang, limited. As in this company I used everywhere my name (although I am not the only owner), I think they connected this company PayPal account with my personal business account via my name (and not via Ebay) and also with the prehistoric PayPal account that I almost forgot I even had.

As the only account that was limited because of some reason, other than being linked to another limited account, was my company PayPal and that happened most probably because of the new eshop sales, I am sitll in very slight hope that maybe I could get that one restored.

The new account I opened after having it limited was on my personal name so I didnt make the company PayPal account any dirty directly.

So I guess from what you write, it will be best to 1) keep trying to reach the PayPal from my company PayPal account clarifying the whole situation about new eshop, 2) keep trying to reach the PayPal also from my personal business account explaining that my personal business is not the company business and thus the accounts are not linked, and 3) at the same time start new personal business stealth accounts on Ebay and PayPal for the very probable scenario that they will do nothing?

Sorry for the long story.

PS: I also fu**ed my name with PayPal already years back when I was 15 and was trading with some crap from China and needed PayPal and thus falsely told them I was 18 and got banned later. So it is maybe surprise that they even left me free for long.
Lots to take in here Although it would take me too long to grasp this scenario, I sense that you are well aware of the possible ways your accounts could have been connected and the reasons for being flagged as "high risk", which is a good start. Most of PayPal's linking methods would be as simple as the: name, address, IP, computer/browser and perhaps also connected eBay accounts. Only you will know what matters to address in your correspondence with PayPal.

So yeah, ignore for now the accounts that are limited "because of other limited accounts" and focus on the first limitation (which you said was "high risk"). Use the template provided if you wish and really go into depth about what your business does while keeping it concise.

I have no experience with going stealth, but I assume it involves faking the identity/name, in which case there's no harm in trying it, as long as you cover any tracks that could link you to your authentic accounts. Regardless of how your appeals go with PayPal, I would agree with most people on this forum about having backups in the form of stealth accounts.

Finally, about the age-related ban, this was also my first limitation, however, I do remember their support team advising me to create a new account (as they limited me after I was already old enough), so I'm assuming this is not something they hold against you forever (but rather until you're old enough).
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Default Re: [Guide] [Account Restored] Permanent Limitation (with 180-day hold)

Wow that’s awesome thanks for the guide I’m sure it will help many and congratulations on getting your paypal back
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